From keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk Thu Jun 1 03:59:42 2006 From: keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk (Keith Hodges) Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2006 02:59:42 +0100 Subject: Notes on Visitors Message-ID: <447E4A0E.9020600@yahoo.co.uk> I have started posting some notes on the wiki http://smallwiki.unibe.ch/smallwiki/pier/visitors/ feedback invited, is this style of note useful to anyone? Keith ___________________________________________________________ All new Yahoo! Mail "The new Interface is stunning in its simplicity and ease of use." - PC Magazine http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html From Keith.Hodges at warwick.ac.uk Thu Jun 1 04:04:08 2006 From: Keith.Hodges at warwick.ac.uk (Keith Hodges) Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2006 03:04:08 +0100 Subject: Notes on Visitors Message-ID: <447E4B18.5020808@warwick.ac.uk> I have started posting some notes on the wiki http://smallwiki.unibe.ch/smallwiki/pier/visitors/ feedback invited, is this style of note useful to anyone? Keith ___________________________________________________________ All New Yahoo! Mail ? Tired of Vi at gr@! come-ons? Let our SpamGuard protect you. http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html From renggli at iam.unibe.ch Thu Jun 1 11:55:53 2006 From: renggli at iam.unibe.ch (Lukas Renggli) Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 11:55:53 +0200 Subject: Notes on Visitors In-Reply-To: <447E4A0E.9020600@yahoo.co.uk> References: <447E4A0E.9020600@yahoo.co.uk> Message-ID: <578E9A06-365E-4BA7-8E7A-B7AD547282E7@iam.unibe.ch> Hi Keith, > I have started posting some notes on the wiki > > http://smallwiki.unibe.ch/smallwiki/pier/visitors/ > > feedback invited, is this style of note useful to anyone? yes, I think this is very useful. Thanks for this contribution. To answer your wiki questions (maybe you should subscribe to the mailing list and post them here): > I think that there should be a Server Control UI - I would revive > Starbrowser if I could find all the parts. And star browser may be > a good solution for reorganising heirarchical wikis - just a thought If you have the latest version of OmniBrowser installed, you get a GUI that can do everything you can do from the web. No drag and drop yet, but that would be simple to add. > I think that basic file serving should be enabled out of the box, > perhaps even with ssp as standard. Sometimes it is just useful to > have a simple solution for things. For example my javascript > spec.js framework generates HTML files. Static file-serving is more tricky, I don't exactly understand what your goal is. Lukas -- Lukas Renggli http://www.lukas-renggli.ch From rickf at ca-flower.com Fri Jun 2 00:17:48 2006 From: rickf at ca-flower.com (Rick Flower) Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2006 15:17:48 -0700 Subject: Porting Magritte over to VisualWorks.. In-Reply-To: <67628d690603030030p741dd950j86c87f7cd3c5df21@mail.gmail.com> References: <24C40DFA333DC44882F9FB0115F33D8F499FC4@ARGON.insario.local> <67628d690602091412m3cd20dd9s656d6e4d7cd4de72@mail.gmail.com> <44079BBA.5090403@ca-flower.com> <67628d690603030030p741dd950j86c87f7cd3c5df21@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <447F678C.3000100@ca-flower.com> Lukas Renggli wrote: > First of all you need PackageInfo-Exporters from SqueakMap. Then you > need the package "Magritte-VisualWorks" from > . Evaluating "MADistribution > fileOutForVisualWorks" should produce you a couple of files that can > be loaded into VisualWorks, however I never actually tried to do it > ;-) > Lukas, I did as instructed above (after taking a bit of time to learn how to use Squeak a bit).. I used your Magritte-VisualWorks-lr.7.mcz since it was the latest version on your above listed site. I evaluated "MADistribution fileOutForVisualWorks" and it spit out the following files : -rw-rw-r-- 1 rickf users 256576 Jun 1 14:29 Magritte-Model-vw5.st -rw-rw-r-- 1 rickf users 166154 Jun 1 14:29 Magritte-Seaside-vw5.st -rw-rw-r-- 1 rickf users 162601 Jun 1 14:29 Magritte-Tests-vw5.st I didn't know what order to load them into VW7.4 so I loaded the biggest first (Magritte-Model) and it loaded without even a single complaint. I then proceeded to load the "Magritte-Seaside" file and then the last "Tests" file -- all without any complaints. Now however, I'm not sure what I can do to test this thing out.. Any ideas? I've saved my image so I can screw it up if needed without harming any of my other work.. -- Rick From renggli at iam.unibe.ch Fri Jun 2 08:06:37 2006 From: renggli at iam.unibe.ch (Lukas Renggli) Date: Fri, 2 Jun 2006 08:06:37 +0200 Subject: Porting Magritte over to VisualWorks.. In-Reply-To: <447F678C.3000100@ca-flower.com> References: <24C40DFA333DC44882F9FB0115F33D8F499FC4@ARGON.insario.local> <67628d690602091412m3cd20dd9s656d6e4d7cd4de72@mail.gmail.com> <44079BBA.5090403@ca-flower.com> <67628d690603030030p741dd950j86c87f7cd3c5df21@mail.gmail.com> <447F678C.3000100@ca-flower.com> Message-ID: <1A038E0F-CA81-4B19-BE8B-EA01E2EF5103@iam.unibe.ch> > I didn't know what order to load them into VW7.4 so I loaded the > biggest > first (Magritte-Model) > and it loaded without even a single complaint. I then proceeded to > load > the "Magritte-Seaside" > file and then the last "Tests" file -- all without any complaints. > Now > however, I'm not sure > what I can do to test this thing out.. Any ideas? I've saved my image > so I can screw it up if > needed without harming any of my other work.. Hi Rick, sounds great. The order should be: 1. Magritte-Model-vw5.st 2. Magritte-Tests-vw5.st (tests/depends on model) 3. Magritte-Seaside-vw5.st (depends on model) The last package of course also depends on Seaside, that comes with a bunch of Squeak compatibility methods that might help for the other packages as well. One problem I know is the missing #initialize in Object. So what you certainly need to do is to add to all classes in Squeak that directly inherit from Object. MyObj class>>new ^ super new initialize MyObj>>initialize I would suggest that you directly do this in Squeak, so that further porting becomes easier. I don't know what other problems to expect. Running the tests should certainly show the most ;-) Cheers, Lukas -- Lukas Renggli http://www.lukas-renggli.ch From thf at impara.de Fri Jun 2 18:40:58 2006 From: thf at impara.de (Thomas Froeb) Date: Fri, 02 Jun 2006 18:40:58 +0200 Subject: [Pier] Had anybody Spamming Problems yet? Message-ID: <44806A1A.7030409@impara.de> Hi, a couple of days ago we had Spam at our Gsug-Pier. The spammer created a page which linked directly to a page where pills and this stuff is selled. Had anybody made similar Experiences. Any suggestions how to prevent this? Greetings, Thomas From rickf at ca-flower.com Fri Jun 2 18:44:11 2006 From: rickf at ca-flower.com (Rick Flower) Date: Fri, 02 Jun 2006 09:44:11 -0700 Subject: Porting Magritte over to VisualWorks.. In-Reply-To: <67628d690603030030p741dd950j86c87f7cd3c5df21@mail.gmail.com> References: <24C40DFA333DC44882F9FB0115F33D8F499FC4@ARGON.insario.local> <67628d690602091412m3cd20dd9s656d6e4d7cd4de72@mail.gmail.com> <44079BBA.5090403@ca-flower.com> <67628d690603030030p741dd950j86c87f7cd3c5df21@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <44806ADB.80505@ca-flower.com> Lukas Renggli wrote: >sounds great. The order should be: >1. Magritte-Model-vw5.st >2. Magritte-Tests-vw5.st (tests/depends on model) >3. Magritte-Seaside-vw5.st (depends on model) >The last package of course also depends on Seaside, that comes with a >bunch of Squeak compatibility methods that might help for the other >packages as well. Ok.. I lied (or spoke too soon).. Apparently when I hastily did this import yesterday, I forgot (haven't worked in the Smalltalk environment for several months now) to have some of the other windows visible and didn't see the following complaints (for loading just the model file) being spewed to the console: Filing in from: /home/rickf/src/dev/smalltalk/squeak/Magritte-Model-vw5.st (Object #mementoClass - MACheckedMemento is undeclared) (Class #defaultContainer - MAPriorityContainer is undeclared) (Object class #description - MACachedBuilder is undeclared) (BlockContext #asCondition - MAConditionBuilder is undeclared) (Magritte.MACachedBuilder #register - SystemChangeNotifier is undeclared) (Magritte.MAColorDescription #kind - Color - duplicateBindings) (Magritte.MAColorDescription #kind - Color is undeclared) (Magritte.MADateDescription #kind - Date - duplicateBindings) (Magritte.MADateDescription #kind - Date is undeclared) (Magritte.MADistribution #publish - HTTPSocket is undeclared) (Magritte.MADistribution #zip - ZipArchive is undeclared) (Magritte.MADistribution #addPackage: - MCWorkingCopy is undeclared) (Magritte.MADistribution #basePackages - MCPackage is undeclared) (Magritte.MADistribution #addPackage:workingCopy: - MCVersion is undeclared) (Magritte.MADurationDescription #kind - Duration is undeclared) (Magritte.MADynamicObject #realSubject - UnhandledError is undeclared) (Magritte.MATimeDescription #kind - Time - duplicateBindings) (Magritte.MATimeDescription #kind - Time is undeclared) (Magritte.MATimeStampDescription #kind - TimeStamp is undeclared) (Magritte.MACompatibility class #confirm: - PopUpMenu is undeclared) (Magritte.MACompatibility class #referenceStream: - ReferenceStream is undeclared) (Magritte.MACompatibility class #referenceStream: - RWBinaryOrTextStream is undeclared) (Magritte.MACompatibility class #request:default: - FillInTheBlankMorph is undeclared) (Magritte.MACompatibility class #request:default: - ActiveHand is undeclared) (Magritte.MACompatibility class #request:default: - ActiveWorld is undeclared) (Magritte.MACompatibility class #uuid - UUID is undeclared) I'm assuming that these are defined in the Squeak environment and were just missed on the export from the squeak to visualworks environment.. If that's correct, what should I look for in order to adjust the output to get them included as well.. If that's not what I should be looking for, can you point me in the right direction? Also -- IF I'm able to get things all loaded up OK and add the missing initialize methods as you indicated earlier, how do I go about running the tests? I poked around in some of the test code last night but wasn't sure how to go about running these tests.. Thanks! -- Rick From johnson at cs.uiuc.edu Fri Jun 2 20:27:53 2006 From: johnson at cs.uiuc.edu (Ralph Johnson) Date: Fri, 2 Jun 2006 13:27:53 -0500 Subject: [Pier] Had anybody Spamming Problems yet? In-Reply-To: <44806A1A.7030409@impara.de> References: <44806A1A.7030409@impara.de> Message-ID: I've had this problem on my wikis. One solution is to put passwords on them. When I have a wiki for a class, I usually make one password for the whole class, and it is usually something like "password" or the name of the class. For other wikis, we have a spam filter. We have a database of banned domains, and if you try to write a page that contains a URL for a banned domain, the wiki pretends to accept the write but actually throws it away. This, coupled with the ability to go back to a previous version of a page, keeps the spam to a minimum. I've done this for WikiWorks and swiki, but not for Pier. -Ralph Johnson From keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk Sat Jun 3 05:11:41 2006 From: keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk (Keith Hodges) Date: Sat, 03 Jun 2006 04:11:41 +0100 Subject: SqueakSource and Pier Message-ID: <4480FDED.3000403@yahoo.co.uk> Lukas, The wiki in squeaksource does not seem to be that tightly coupled to squeaksource itself. For the time being you could run a separate pier server on seasidehosting.st to host it. This instance of Pier could be styled to look similar to the Squeaksource. The "wiki" link on SqueakSource could be directed at the Pier instance in such a way as to create or goto the project page with the given name. This would not enable private wikis but it might give the community the tools it needs to document their stuff in context. thoughts? Keith ___________________________________________________________ Try the all-new Yahoo! Mail. "The New Version is radically easier to use" ? The Wall Street Journal http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html From renggli at iam.unibe.ch Sat Jun 3 10:57:54 2006 From: renggli at iam.unibe.ch (Lukas Renggli) Date: Sat, 3 Jun 2006 10:57:54 +0200 Subject: SqueakSource and Pier In-Reply-To: <4480FDED.3000403@yahoo.co.uk> References: <4480FDED.3000403@yahoo.co.uk> Message-ID: <39A56F43-432D-4385-8088-E32C910E0843@iam.unibe.ch> > The wiki in squeaksource does not seem to be that tightly coupled to > squeaksource itself. For the time being you could run a separate pier > server on seasidehosting.st to host it. This instance of Pier could be > styled to look similar to the Squeaksource. The "wiki" link on > SqueakSource could be directed at the Pier instance in such a way > as to > create or goto the project page with the given name. This would not > enable private wikis but it might give the community the tools it > needs > to document their stuff in context. Why not just link the external Wiki trough the SqueakSource Wiki or the project description? Lukas -- Lukas Renggli http://www.lukas-renggli.ch From keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk Sat Jun 3 17:58:34 2006 From: keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk (Keith Hodges) Date: Sat, 03 Jun 2006 16:58:34 +0100 Subject: [Smallwiki] Re: SqueakSource and Pier In-Reply-To: <39A56F43-432D-4385-8088-E32C910E0843@iam.unibe.ch> References: <4480FDED.3000403@yahoo.co.uk> <39A56F43-432D-4385-8088-E32C910E0843@iam.unibe.ch> Message-ID: <4481B1AA.10601@yahoo.co.uk> Sure , but I was thinking that this idea would work for all projects. Keith > Why not just link the external Wiki trough the SqueakSource Wiki or > the project description? > > Lukas > > ___________________________________________________________ All new Yahoo! Mail "The new Interface is stunning in its simplicity and ease of use." - PC Magazine http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html From Keith.Hodges at warwick.ac.uk Mon Jun 5 02:57:51 2006 From: Keith.Hodges at warwick.ac.uk (Keith Hodges) Date: Mon, 05 Jun 2006 01:57:51 +0100 Subject: Parser Bug? Message-ID: <4483818F.20201@warwick.ac.uk> In the wiki parser I see the lines HorizontalRule : { #addHorizontalRule } | 'rule' Paragraph { self items children addFirst: (self createText: rule value) } ; items is initialized to an OrderedCollection, which I do not think responds to children. It does manage to pass the tests though. Keith ___________________________________________________________ The all-new Yahoo! Mail goes wherever you go - free your email address from your Internet provider. http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html From keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk Mon Jun 5 03:28:48 2006 From: keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk (Keith Hodges) Date: Mon, 05 Jun 2006 02:28:48 +0100 Subject: [Smallwiki] Parser Bug? In-Reply-To: <4483818F.20201@warwick.ac.uk> References: <4483818F.20201@warwick.ac.uk> Message-ID: <448388D0.8060009@yahoo.co.uk> Lukas, I found this code in the parser: reduceActionForHorizontalRule2: nodes ^ self items last setChildren: (self createText: (nodes at: 1) value) , self items last children which means that the code in the class does not match that contained in the definition comment. Do you have a more recent scanner/parser definition lying around somewhere? Keith > In the wiki parser I see the lines > > HorizontalRule > : { #addHorizontalRule } > | 'rule' Paragraph { self items children addFirst: > (self createText: rule value) } ; > > items is initialized to an OrderedCollection, which I do not think > responds to children. It does manage to pass the tests though. > > Keith > ___________________________________________________________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com From renggli at iam.unibe.ch Mon Jun 5 11:05:01 2006 From: renggli at iam.unibe.ch (Lukas Renggli) Date: Mon, 5 Jun 2006 11:05:01 +0200 Subject: [Smallwiki] Parser Bug? In-Reply-To: <448388D0.8060009@yahoo.co.uk> References: <4483818F.20201@warwick.ac.uk> <448388D0.8060009@yahoo.co.uk> Message-ID: <395BC0DB-3557-4DCF-B20F-9648EBAEB48C@iam.unibe.ch> Hi Keith, this is rather strange to have the parser definition and the code not in sync. I don't know how this could have happened. I fixed the reported bug in the latest version and recompiled the parser from the definition, all the tests pass again. Thanks for reporting. Cheers, Lukas On 5 Jun 2006, at 03:28, Keith Hodges wrote: > Lukas, > > I found this code in the parser: > > reduceActionForHorizontalRule2: nodes > ^ self items last setChildren: (self createText: (nodes at: 1) > value) , self items last children > > which means that the code in the class does not match that > contained in > the definition comment. > > Do you have a more recent scanner/parser definition lying around > somewhere? > > Keith > >> In the wiki parser I see the lines >> >> HorizontalRule >> : { #addHorizontalRule } >> | 'rule' Paragraph { self items children >> addFirst: >> (self createText: rule value) } ; >> >> items is initialized to an OrderedCollection, which I do not think >> responds to children. It does manage to pass the tests though. >> >> Keith >> > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all > new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com > > _______________________________________________ > SmallWiki, Magritte, Pier and Related Tools ... > https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/smallwiki -- Lukas Renggli http://www.lukas-renggli.ch From smoerk at gmail.com Mon Jun 5 12:36:27 2006 From: smoerk at gmail.com (smoerk) Date: Mon, 5 Jun 2006 12:36:27 +0200 Subject: installation on server Message-ID: <1b7ee9a0606050336t391e1d5dyc9718aaf813ce67e@mail.gmail.com> hello, i'm new to pier and seaside. the wiki and seaside looks great. what i find really painful is the way you install and run seaside and pier in squeak. how do i easily install pier on a server in a shell (without a GUI)? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.iam.unibe.ch/pipermail/smallwiki/attachments/20060605/26b9888b/attachment.html From philippe.marschall at gmail.com Mon Jun 5 12:58:34 2006 From: philippe.marschall at gmail.com (Philippe Marschall) Date: Mon, 5 Jun 2006 12:58:34 +0200 Subject: http://www.logowiki.net In-Reply-To: <577FB52D-6BBD-4E91-8ACC-6E18709D22F5@univ-savoie.fr> References: <577FB52D-6BBD-4E91-8ACC-6E18709D22F5@univ-savoie.fr> Message-ID: <66666f210606050358v316296b9gbe24f748521964ce@mail.gmail.com> It seems to be down, which is a pity. It's also referenced by a post. http://www.ethanzuckerman.com/blog/?p=824 BTW, can the code be downloaded somewhere? Philippe 2006/4/19, St?phane Ducasse : > :) > read the about :) > > _______________________________________________ > SmallWiki, Magritte, Pier and Related Tools ... > https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/smallwiki > From renggli at iam.unibe.ch Mon Jun 5 16:54:51 2006 From: renggli at iam.unibe.ch (Lukas Renggli) Date: Mon, 5 Jun 2006 16:54:51 +0200 Subject: installation on server In-Reply-To: <1b7ee9a0606050336t391e1d5dyc9718aaf813ce67e@mail.gmail.com> References: <1b7ee9a0606050336t391e1d5dyc9718aaf813ce67e@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <473CC5D5-D1A2-4ADC-8C28-CE27D87B58C3@iam.unibe.ch> > i'm new to pier and seaside. the wiki and seaside looks great. what > i find really painful is the way you install and run seaside and > pier in squeak. Painful? There is a one-click installer on SqueakMap that provides automatically loads all the requirements to run Pier. I will soon provide a similar one-click installation for Seaside, as discussed at Smalltalk Solutions, unfortunately that had to wait because I was busy finishing my Master Thesis. > how do i easily install pier on a server in a shell (without a GUI)? You copy a ready image, that you created on a desktop machine, to the server. This is what we are doing for most of our applications. The nature of Smalltalk allows one to interact, e.g. update code, fix problems, load plugins, with the application while it is running. There is usually no need to have a down-time or to setup a second server to take over while doing maintenance work. It is possible to run Squeak without a graphical user interface though, however this will take away a lot of power from the environment. If you server doesn't allow to have a graphical user interface it is also possible to install a VNC server in your image so you can interact like that. Cheers, Lukas -- Lukas Renggli http://www.lukas-renggli.ch From cputney at wiresong.ca Mon Jun 5 17:24:11 2006 From: cputney at wiresong.ca (Colin Putney) Date: Mon, 5 Jun 2006 11:24:11 -0400 Subject: http://www.logowiki.net In-Reply-To: <66666f210606050358v316296b9gbe24f748521964ce@mail.gmail.com> References: <577FB52D-6BBD-4E91-8ACC-6E18709D22F5@univ-savoie.fr> <66666f210606050358v316296b9gbe24f748521964ce@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <25613241-91C8-4234-B043-98279FE076F5@wiresong.ca> On Jun 5, 2006, at 6:58 AM, Philippe Marschall wrote: > It seems to be down, which is a pity. It's also referenced by a post. > http://www.ethanzuckerman.com/blog/?p=824 Oops. That's fixed now. > BTW, can the code be downloaded somewhere? Mostly. The only modifications to the server are stylesheets and a hack to make preformatted text render as the logo editor. The logo interpreter is written entirely in Javascript, so you can download it any time. Also, it can run on any web page, not just wiki pages. If you want to play with it, just stick the following snippet into a web page and open it in a browser.

run reset
From renggli at iam.unibe.ch Mon Jun 5 17:29:56 2006 From: renggli at iam.unibe.ch (Lukas Renggli) Date: Mon, 5 Jun 2006 17:29:56 +0200 Subject: Porting Magritte over to VisualWorks.. In-Reply-To: <44806ADB.80505@ca-flower.com> References: <24C40DFA333DC44882F9FB0115F33D8F499FC4@ARGON.insario.local> <67628d690602091412m3cd20dd9s656d6e4d7cd4de72@mail.gmail.com> <44079BBA.5090403@ca-flower.com> <67628d690603030030p741dd950j86c87f7cd3c5df21@mail.gmail.com> <44806ADB.80505@ca-flower.com> Message-ID: > (Object #mementoClass - MACheckedMemento is undeclared) > (Class #defaultContainer - MAPriorityContainer is undeclared) > (Object class #description - MACachedBuilder is undeclared) > (BlockContext #asCondition - MAConditionBuilder is undeclared) > (Magritte.MACachedBuilder #register - SystemChangeNotifier is > undeclared) > (Magritte.MAColorDescription #kind - Color - duplicateBindings) > (Magritte.MAColorDescription #kind - Color is undeclared) > (Magritte.MADateDescription #kind - Date - duplicateBindings) > (Magritte.MADateDescription #kind - Date is undeclared) > (Magritte.MADistribution #publish - HTTPSocket is undeclared) > (Magritte.MADistribution #zip - ZipArchive is undeclared) > (Magritte.MADistribution #addPackage: - MCWorkingCopy is undeclared) > (Magritte.MADistribution #basePackages - MCPackage is undeclared) > (Magritte.MADistribution #addPackage:workingCopy: - MCVersion is > undeclared) > (Magritte.MADurationDescription #kind - Duration is undeclared) > (Magritte.MADynamicObject #realSubject - UnhandledError is undeclared) > (Magritte.MATimeDescription #kind - Time - duplicateBindings) > (Magritte.MATimeDescription #kind - Time is undeclared) > (Magritte.MATimeStampDescription #kind - TimeStamp is undeclared) These should be all dispatched trough the class MACompatiblity, as these seems to be things that cannot be resolved in VisualWorks automatically. I guess for most of these problems this is just a namespace import that is missing. > (Magritte.MACompatibility class #confirm: - PopUpMenu is undeclared) > (Magritte.MACompatibility class #referenceStream: - ReferenceStream > is undeclared) > (Magritte.MACompatibility class #referenceStream: - > RWBinaryOrTextStream is undeclared) > (Magritte.MACompatibility class #request:default: - > FillInTheBlankMorph is undeclared) > (Magritte.MACompatibility class #request:default: - ActiveHand is > undeclared) > (Magritte.MACompatibility class #request:default: - ActiveWorld is > undeclared) > (Magritte.MACompatibility class #uuid - UUID is undeclared) These are all things that you need to fix manually tough an override in VisualWorks. It is related to platform dependent code that cannot be written in a generic way, but the comments should help you implement those methods easily. > Also -- IF I'm able to get things all loaded up OK and add the > missing initialize > methods as you indicated earlier, how do I go about running the tests? I don't know. These are just standard SUnit tests that will likely run in the VisualWorks test runner. Cheers, Lukas -- Lukas Renggli http://www.lukas-renggli.ch From renggli at iam.unibe.ch Mon Jun 5 17:36:13 2006 From: renggli at iam.unibe.ch (Lukas Renggli) Date: Mon, 5 Jun 2006 17:36:13 +0200 Subject: [ANN] Magritte -- Meta-Described Web Application Development In-Reply-To: <448447C9.8000909@enit.fr> References: <1b7ee9a0606050336t391e1d5dyc9718aaf813ce67e@mail.gmail.com> <473CC5D5-D1A2-4ADC-8C28-CE27D87B58C3@iam.unibe.ch> <448447C9.8000909@enit.fr> Message-ID: >> unfortunately that had to wait because I was busy finishing my >> Master Thesis. >> > did you ;) ? > > If possible can you send me a copy ? even of a draft version The final version of my Master Thesis is available to download from the SCG repository. It covers Magritte and Pier and should give some insight and additional documentation about the use and the implementation of those frameworks. It can be downloaded from: Abstract: Developing applications that end users can customize is a challenge, since end users are domain experts but still have concrete requirements. In this master thesis we present how we used a meta- driven approach to support the end user customization of Web applications. We present Magritte, a recursive meta-data meta-model integrated into the Smalltalk reflective meta-model. The adaptive model of Magritte enables to not only describe existing classes but also let end users build their own meta-models on the fly. Further on we describe how meta-interpreters automatically build views, reports, validating editors and persistency mechanisms. As a complete example of how we applied a meta-model to a Web application we present Pier, the second version of a fully object- oriented implementation of a content management system and Wiki engine. Pier is implemented with objects from the top to the bottom and is designed to be customizable to accommodate new needs. The integration of a powerful meta-description layer makes it a breeze to extend the running system with new functionality without having to patch the core engine. We describe the lessons learned from using the Magritte meta-model to build applications. Both projects described in this thesis are open source and can be downloaded from the Web site of the author. Have fun, Lukas -- Lukas Renggli http://www.lukas-renggli.ch From renggli at iam.unibe.ch Mon Jun 5 17:38:27 2006 From: renggli at iam.unibe.ch (Lukas Renggli) Date: Mon, 5 Jun 2006 17:38:27 +0200 Subject: [ANN] Magritte -- Meta-Described Web Application Development In-Reply-To: References: <1b7ee9a0606050336t391e1d5dyc9718aaf813ce67e@mail.gmail.com> <473CC5D5-D1A2-4ADC-8C28-CE27D87B58C3@iam.unibe.ch> <448447C9.8000909@enit.fr> Message-ID: > query=Reng06a&abstract=yes> If the link does not work try this one: Lukas -- Lukas Renggli http://www.lukas-renggli.ch From cbeler at enit.fr Mon Jun 5 21:07:06 2006 From: cbeler at enit.fr (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?C=E9drick_B=E9ler?=) Date: Mon, 05 Jun 2006 21:07:06 +0200 Subject: problem with Pier Message-ID: <448480DA.8030500@enit.fr> Hi It's two time I have the same problem with a fresh version of Pier in a 3.9-7033 (even 7032) When I edit az page and when I save, each space characters are "transformed" in + making a long line with links... edit: "Welcome+to+Pier+(formerly+called+SmallWiki+2),+the+,+next+,+generation+ " Did someone had the same problem ? Thanks C?drick From renggli at iam.unibe.ch Mon Jun 5 21:46:03 2006 From: renggli at iam.unibe.ch (Lukas Renggli) Date: Mon, 5 Jun 2006 21:46:03 +0200 Subject: problem with Pier In-Reply-To: <448480DA.8030500@enit.fr> References: <448480DA.8030500@enit.fr> Message-ID: <78B5B003-4977-43AB-B367-A74F1F9E6FC9@iam.unibe.ch> > It's two time I have the same problem with a fresh version of Pier > in a > 3.9-7033 (even 7032) > > When I edit az page and when I save, each space characters are > "transformed" in + making a long line with links... > edit: > "Welcome+to+Pier+(formerly+called+SmallWiki+2),+the+,+next+, > +generation+ " > > Did someone had the same problem ? This is a problem with Squeak 3.9. The first 3.9 images worked, then it suddenly broke. I didn't had the time to investigate that, but it isn't related to Pier. A plain Seaside application shows the same problems. Cheers, Lukas -- Lukas Renggli http://www.lukas-renggli.ch From ramon.leon at allresnet.com Mon Jun 5 21:59:53 2006 From: ramon.leon at allresnet.com (Ramon Leon) Date: Mon, 5 Jun 2006 12:59:53 -0700 Subject: [ANN] Magritte -- Meta-Described Web Application Development In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000001c688da$9c67e360$4b00a8c0@hq.allresnet.com> > The final version of my Master Thesis is available to > download from the SCG repository. It covers Magritte and Pier > and should give some insight and additional documentation > about the use and the implementation of those frameworks. It > can be downloaded from: > > query=Reng06a&abstract=yes> > > Lukas Renggli > http://www.lukas-renggli.ch Congratulations man, I look forward to reading it, I'm sure it'll help the community a lot. -- Ramon Leon From cbeler at enit.fr Tue Jun 6 09:51:15 2006 From: cbeler at enit.fr (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?C=E9drick_B=E9ler?=) Date: Tue, 06 Jun 2006 09:51:15 +0200 Subject: problem with Pier In-Reply-To: <78B5B003-4977-43AB-B367-A74F1F9E6FC9@iam.unibe.ch> References: <448480DA.8030500@enit.fr> <78B5B003-4977-43AB-B367-A74F1F9E6FC9@iam.unibe.ch> Message-ID: <448533F3.9060201@enit.fr> >>It's two time I have the same problem with a fresh version of Pier >>in a >>3.9-7033 (even 7032) >> >>When I edit az page and when I save, each space characters are >>"transformed" in + making a long line with links... >>edit: >>"Welcome+to+Pier+(formerly+called+SmallWiki+2),+the+,+next+, >>+generation+ " >> >>Did someone had the same problem ? >> >> > >This is a problem with Squeak 3.9. The first 3.9 images worked, then >it suddenly broke. I didn't had the time to investigate that, but it >isn't related to Pier. A plain Seaside application shows the same >problems. > > > Oh ok I thought it was due to some code of mine I added... When you say a plain seaside app, it is that editing texts produce the same effect ? (didn't notice) So do you use 3.9 in your development ? if yes wich version otherwise I'll get back to a 3.8 version but I'd like to use a 3.9 :) Thanks C?drick ps: and great work Lukas with your report ;)... From karl.ramberg at chello.se Thu Jun 8 08:54:33 2006 From: karl.ramberg at chello.se (karl) Date: Thu, 08 Jun 2006 08:54:33 +0200 Subject: Style script for new squeakfoundation.org wanted! In-Reply-To: <3AA3A7E5-B743-45B4-9AE1-0366D1E1728C@iam.unibe.ch> References: <20060605170156.37871.qmail@web31815.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <3AA3A7E5-B743-45B4-9AE1-0366D1E1728C@iam.unibe.ch> Message-ID: <4487C9A9.4020908@chello.se> With lots of help there is now a image with seaside/pier running to host the new www.squeakfoundation.org site. www.squeak.org:7780/seaside/pier (for the time being) But it needs a little style script tuning. The foundation logo should be there somewhere etc. Logo is here: http://smallwiki.unibe.ch/squeakfoundation/squeakfoundationlogo/ I can't offer much more than a big thank you and membership of the Webteam for the winner. Happy hacking Karl From damien.pollet at gmail.com Thu Jun 8 15:34:50 2006 From: damien.pollet at gmail.com (Damien Pollet) Date: Thu, 8 Jun 2006 15:34:50 +0200 Subject: Blank lines parse as paragraphs? Message-ID: <34b4844b0606080634q4f11b57etd6c6e04b1aae8994@mail.gmail.com> Hi, according to PRParagraphTest#testParseSpare, a blank line in the input should produce an empty paragraph... I'd prefer something like in LaTeX where linefeeds are like spaces but blank lines separate paragraphs... In fact I'm trying to adapt a CSS to Pier, but the environment is parsed as a paragraph: PRDocumentParser parse: '
foo
' "returns a PRParagraph" So the html output is incorrect---well, it's legal HTML but it doesn't mean much semantically to have everything in a

... Also, is it really simpler to use SmaCC than to write a recursive descent parser (sort of reversed Interpreter pattern)? Granted, only writing the grammar is cool, but how do you debug an LALR transition table? (I feel trollish asking that, but I just want your opinion/experience(s)) -- Damien Pollet type less, do more From Keith.Hodges at warwick.ac.uk Fri Jun 9 02:40:20 2006 From: Keith.Hodges at warwick.ac.uk (Keith Hodges) Date: Fri, 09 Jun 2006 01:40:20 +0100 Subject: Questions Message-ID: <4488C374.2030706@warwick.ac.uk> I have been having a look around pier for a few days, I am a beginner at this so please bear with me. Is there a way to have a flat wiki? It appears that new pages are instanciated as children by default. This appears to mean that it would be difficult to recreate the kind of c2.com wiki in which a web of new pages are created at the same level. Is there an option somewhere? I am wondering what the design decisions are on this score, it would be interesting to understand the reasoning. The Settings command is not working for me, can anyone enlighten me as to what it does? Although I like the heirarchy very much, I think I would like the option of building a virtual heirarchy via tagging as well as an explict heirarchy via administrative moving within an otherwise flat wiki namespace. I have an implementation of tiddlywiki that does this. If a page is tagged with a tag it becomes a content item in the tag-page. So tagging a page "User" would make that page a child of users. I havent quite got my head around the hidden pages. How does one create a new environment in a subwiki? In zope, (a four letter word!) if I remember correctly a SecurityManager can be installed at any level in the heirarchy. It looks to me like there could be /environment /style /security items at all levels. (how about /.environment /.style /.background /.security) would this be possible? I think that all squeak project creators should be encouraged to write a dissertation. I found Lukas' paper to be excellent. Thank you very much Keith ___________________________________________________________ All New Yahoo! Mail ? Tired of Vi at gr@! come-ons? Let our SpamGuard protect you. http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html From renggli at iam.unibe.ch Fri Jun 9 07:11:44 2006 From: renggli at iam.unibe.ch (Lukas Renggli) Date: Fri, 9 Jun 2006 07:11:44 +0200 Subject: Blank lines parse as paragraphs? In-Reply-To: <34b4844b0606080634q4f11b57etd6c6e04b1aae8994@mail.gmail.com> References: <34b4844b0606080634q4f11b57etd6c6e04b1aae8994@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <45524110-8DE6-49D9-9234-F044CDFEDB88@iam.unibe.ch> Hi Damien, > according to PRParagraphTest#testParseSpare, a blank line in the input > should produce an empty paragraph... I'd prefer something like in > LaTeX where linefeeds are like spaces but blank lines separate > paragraphs... that is certainly possible, but you need to modify the parser. > In fact I'm trying to adapt a CSS to Pier, but the environment is > parsed as a paragraph: > PRDocumentParser parse: '

foo
' "returns a PRParagraph" > So the html output is incorrect---well, it's legal HTML but it doesn't > mean much semantically to have everything in a

... you are probably not using the latest version. Earlier versions of Pier generated that kind of code and it is invalid to have a div (block-element) inside of a

. The current version of Pier generates

. This is valid and can be easily configured using CSS selectors, so that i behaves different to paragraphs in a Wiki page. > Also, is it really simpler to use SmaCC than to write a recursive > descent parser (sort of reversed Interpreter pattern)? Granted, only > writing the grammar is cool, but how do you debug an LALR transition > table? (I feel trollish asking that, but I just want your > opinion/experience(s)) I do only black-box testing of the parser: I give input strings and check what is coming back. The tests of the Pier parser actually cover all the rules of the code (at least they did the last time I checked). I guess nobody wants to directly mess with the transition tables, that is too low-level. Mhh, it would be cool to have a tool generating the finit set of valid programs of the maximal size n that can be parsed by a given SmaCC parser, this means to use the parser the inverse way. Cheers, Lukas -- Lukas Renggli http://www.lukas-renggli.ch From Keith.Hodges at warwick.ac.uk Fri Jun 9 07:20:57 2006 From: Keith.Hodges at warwick.ac.uk (Keith Hodges) Date: Fri, 09 Jun 2006 06:20:57 +0100 Subject: Flagging hardwired configuration in Pier Message-ID: <44890539.1080501@warwick.ac.uk> I have browsed all the methods in pier, seeking out hardwired configuration type stuff. The attached changeset (if this list allows) methods which contain hardwired things such as the default name/password, and much much more. After filing in the changeset, open the 'method finder' and search for 'senders of...' the following methods in order to find hard coded items of interest. #pierconfig #label #icon enjoy Keith -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: Pier-Hardwired-Methods.1.cs Url: http://www.iam.unibe.ch/pipermail/smallwiki/attachments/20060609/79b64bc0/Pier-Hardwired-Methods.1-0001.ksh From renggli at iam.unibe.ch Fri Jun 9 07:22:45 2006 From: renggli at iam.unibe.ch (Lukas Renggli) Date: Fri, 9 Jun 2006 07:22:45 +0200 Subject: Questions In-Reply-To: <4488C374.2030706@warwick.ac.uk> References: <4488C374.2030706@warwick.ac.uk> Message-ID: <104103AD-3C02-45FE-A497-85337B7BA41D@iam.unibe.ch> Hi Keith, > Is there a way to have a flat wiki? It appears that new pages are > instanciated as children by default. This appears to mean that it > would > be difficult to recreate the kind of c2.com wiki in which a web of new > pages are created at the same level. Is there an option somewhere? Pier is more of a content management system (CMS) than a Wiki, that's why it allows to structure the data. Of course you could restrict that pages can only be added to the root, but that would require a few changes to the code. > The Settings command is not working for me, can anyone enlighten me as > to what it does? It changes the settings of instances of PRComponent, e.g. go to the environment and check the settings for the widgets there. The reason to have the settings separate form the edit command is because the settings depend on the component class that is actually selected. > Although I like the heirarchy very much, I think I would like the > option > of building a virtual heirarchy via tagging as well as an explict > heirarchy via administrative moving within an otherwise flat wiki > namespace. I have an implementation of tiddlywiki that does this. If a > page is tagged with a tag it becomes a content item in the tag- > page. So > tagging a page "User" would make that page a child of users. That would be an interesting extension indeed. > I havent quite got my head around the hidden pages. How does one > create > a new environment in a subwiki? Copy the existing environment to a new location. There is currently no way to create hidden pages from the Web interface. You have to use the inspector to do that manually. > In zope, (a four letter word!) if I remember correctly a > SecurityManager > can be installed at any level in the heirarchy. It looks to me like > there could be /environment /style /security items at all levels. (how > about /.environment /.style /.background /.security) would this be > possible? Have a look at the ACL security package, it goes a bit more into this direction. As far as I know it is possible to assign users/groups only to be valid in a certain sub-tree. I also thought about having that $. for hidden structures, aka Unix, however I tried to avoid naming conventions as much as possible. If there would be a good taging system we could even avoid to have an 'environment' page with a specific name. > I think that all squeak project creators should be encouraged to > write a > dissertation. I found Lukas' paper to be excellent. Thank you! Cheers, Lukas -- Lukas Renggli http://www.lukas-renggli.ch From keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk Fri Jun 9 07:49:01 2006 From: keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk (Keith Hodges) Date: Fri, 09 Jun 2006 06:49:01 +0100 Subject: Flagging hardwired configuration in Pier Message-ID: <44890BCD.1090108@yahoo.co.uk> I have browsed all the methods in pier, seeking out hardwired configuration type stuff. The attached changeset (if this list allows) methods which contain hardwired things such as the default name/password, and much much more. After filing in the changeset, open the 'method finder' and search for 'senders of...' the following methods in order to find hard coded items of interest. #pierconfig #label #icon enjoy Keith -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: Pier-Hardwired-Methods.1.cs Url: http://www.iam.unibe.ch/pipermail/smallwiki/attachments/20060609/82ec7332/Pier-Hardwired-Methods.1.ksh From philippe.marschall at gmail.com Fri Jun 9 08:47:18 2006 From: philippe.marschall at gmail.com (Philippe Marschall) Date: Fri, 9 Jun 2006 08:47:18 +0200 Subject: Questions In-Reply-To: <104103AD-3C02-45FE-A497-85337B7BA41D@iam.unibe.ch> References: <4488C374.2030706@warwick.ac.uk> <104103AD-3C02-45FE-A497-85337B7BA41D@iam.unibe.ch> Message-ID: <66666f210606082347n7427450ib3cd99b529d68cfd@mail.gmail.com> > Have a look at the ACL security package, it goes a bit more into this > direction. As far as I know it is possible to assign users/groups > only to be valid in a certain sub-tree. Nope this was never done because we never came up with good semantics.What happens if something (user, group, ...) is already defined in a subtree/supertree? Does it matter where you login? What happens if you leave your tree? Stuff like that. In general it would be interesting it you could combine the different security methods but this is not possible at the Moment. Philippe From keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk Fri Jun 9 13:15:23 2006 From: keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk (Keith Hodges) Date: Fri, 09 Jun 2006 12:15:23 +0100 Subject: Upgrade to the environment Message-ID: <4489584B.6030306@yahoo.co.uk> Hello all, I have had a tweak of the way that the environment works, and I am pretty pleased with the result and I hope that Lukas will consider making use of this code. If you would like to have a look then check out http://create.seasidehosting.st The environment as was has been moved to /environment/layout and children. It is itself an editable page - just the place for some power user documentation It now has sub pages for stylesheet and javascript scripts PRLibrary is still used if loaded, but it is redundant in this version. If you remove the environment page a new clean one is instanciated in its place. Ideas for the near future: It should be trivial to add a selector picker to pick a layout/stylesheet from a selection. These selectors are currently hardwired in PRStructure (see senders of #pierconfig) Inheritance is currently unchanged, all of the environment page and contents is inherited or nothing. It shouldn't be too difficult to inherit on a per environment/element basis. I think a generic "lookup in parents" function would be useful for this. enjoy best regards Keith ___________________________________________________________ The all-new Yahoo! Mail goes wherever you go - free your email address from your Internet provider. http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html From keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk Fri Jun 9 13:28:21 2006 From: keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk (Keith Hodges) Date: Fri, 09 Jun 2006 12:28:21 +0100 Subject: [Smallwiki] Upgrade to the environment In-Reply-To: <4489584B.6030306@yahoo.co.uk> References: <4489584B.6030306@yahoo.co.uk> Message-ID: <44895B55.1030204@yahoo.co.uk> Not having much luck with seasidehosting, so if you would like to sneak a look try http://art.hobby-site.com/seaside/art I'll attach a changeset too best regards Keith -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: Pier-environment-changes.2.cs Url: http://www.iam.unibe.ch/pipermail/smallwiki/attachments/20060609/7cc8a108/Pier-environment-changes.2.ksh From damien.cassou at laposte.net Fri Jun 9 13:28:46 2006 From: damien.cassou at laposte.net (Damien Cassou) Date: Fri, 09 Jun 2006 13:28:46 +0200 Subject: Upgrade to the environment In-Reply-To: <4489584B.6030306@yahoo.co.uk> References: <4489584B.6030306@yahoo.co.uk> Message-ID: <44895B6E.5030602@laposte.net> > http://create.seasidehosting.st I get a gateway problem when I try to access this page: Bad Gateway The proxy server received an invalid response from an upstream server. It's not the case with other seasidehosting websites. From renggli at iam.unibe.ch Fri Jun 9 16:53:12 2006 From: renggli at iam.unibe.ch (Lukas Renggli) Date: Fri, 9 Jun 2006 16:53:12 +0200 Subject: Flagging hardwired configuration in Pier In-Reply-To: <44890BCD.1090108@yahoo.co.uk> References: <44890BCD.1090108@yahoo.co.uk> Message-ID: > After filing in the changeset, open the 'method finder' and search for > 'senders of...' the following methods in order to find hard coded > items > of interest. Most of this "hard coded" items end up in instances and can be edited trough the edit- or settings-command from the user interface, or then at least trough an inspector from within the image. > #label > #icon Yes, these parts are more a static thing. Lukas -- Lukas Renggli http://www.lukas-renggli.ch From renggli at iam.unibe.ch Fri Jun 9 16:59:34 2006 From: renggli at iam.unibe.ch (Lukas Renggli) Date: Fri, 9 Jun 2006 16:59:34 +0200 Subject: [Smallwiki] Upgrade to the environment In-Reply-To: <44895B55.1030204@yahoo.co.uk> References: <4489584B.6030306@yahoo.co.uk> <44895B55.1030204@yahoo.co.uk> Message-ID: > !PRStructure methodsFor: '*pier-seaside-configuration' stamp: 'kph > 6/9/2006 11:50'! > environmentStructure > > | environment layout stylesheet | > self flag: #pierconfig. > > "structure then contents" > environment := (PRPage named: 'environment') > addDecoration: PRHider new; > addChild: > (layout := (PRPage named: 'layout') > addChild: ((PRComponent named: 'header') > [...] If you log-in (latest version, I suggest to always use this one) or if you directly type the path to the environment (older versions) you are able to simply edit those things from within your Web browser. Lukas -- Lukas Renggli http://www.lukas-renggli.ch From keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk Sat Jun 10 03:22:32 2006 From: keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk (Keith Hodges) Date: Sat, 10 Jun 2006 02:22:32 +0100 Subject: [Smallwiki] Upgrade to the environment In-Reply-To: References: <4489584B.6030306@yahoo.co.uk> <44895B55.1030204@yahoo.co.uk> Message-ID: <448A1ED8.90507@yahoo.co.uk> >> environmentStructure >> >> | environment layout stylesheet | >> self flag: #pierconfig. >> >> "structure then contents" >> environment := (PRPage named: 'environment') >> addDecoration: PRHider new; >> addChild: >> (layout := (PRPage named: 'layout') >> addChild: ((PRComponent named: 'header') >> [...] >> > > > If you log-in (latest version, I suggest to always use this one) or > what do you mean? I have not seen any access to the environment offered when I log in. It took me three days to even find that the environment existed! Now I am actually using the latest version, though it took me more than a week to learn how to load and run this. > if you directly type the path to the environment (older versions) you > are able to simply edit those things from within your Web browser. > > Lukas > I do understand that you are able to do this. Thats what I did in order to reverse engineer the code to put into environmentStructure. Although pier is very tightly and cleanly architected, I think that am at a different stage in the process. I feel that my contribution is part of the process of making things more usable for the uninitiated. I have the benefit of not knowing anything about pier and having to learn it all from scratch. So I am taking a look at the raw features that pier has and putting them into a context for the new users, specifically power users, who need meta-tools. The old environment is simply a tool for editing one thing, the layout. My implementation of environment has/will become a development space for new layouts, styles and everything else which I dont think really had a place before. You are correct you can directly edit a sub-component by entering the direct url. But I ask the question, how do you learn how to do this if no one has told you, it has to be really obvious. I also think that it is best to get things to a point where the out of the box experience as easy to learn as possible, but we dont want to clutter up the main user wiki content with this stuff, which is what wiki's always used to do. You may not see the need to mark the hard wired things. But for me they are a useful hook for learning things, particularly if you want to tweak things, which is where learning things often starts for me. On reflection it looks like the direction this is leading to is to refactor all of the environment stuff, and some of the pierconfig stuff out of PRStructure into a separate extension module. For want of a better name "PREnvironment" and sons. This would allow Environments (i.e. the out of the box style and configuration) to be selected in the seaside configuration panel, and offer a creative outlet for users to produce a range of pre-configured environments. This becomes the natural starting point for new 'power' users to begin creating bespoke environments, while allowing the core of pier to remain lean and fit. best regards Keith -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.iam.unibe.ch/pipermail/smallwiki/attachments/20060610/4aae4c36/attachment.html From renggli at iam.unibe.ch Sat Jun 10 10:31:44 2006 From: renggli at iam.unibe.ch (Lukas Renggli) Date: Sat, 10 Jun 2006 10:31:44 +0200 Subject: [Smallwiki] Upgrade to the environment In-Reply-To: <448A1ED8.90507@yahoo.co.uk> References: <4489584B.6030306@yahoo.co.uk> <44895B55.1030204@yahoo.co.uk> <448A1ED8.90507@yahoo.co.uk> Message-ID: <1EBCABDB-C763-43C4-BC22-F40F7DCAC4EE@iam.unibe.ch> >>> environmentStructure | environment layout stylesheet | self flag: >>> #pierconfig. "structure then contents" environment := (PRPage >>> named: 'environment') addDecoration: PRHider new; addChild: >>> (layout := (PRPage named: 'layout') addChild: ((PRComponent >>> named: 'header') [...] >> >> If you log-in (latest version, I suggest to always use this one) or > > what do you mean? I have not seen any access to the environment > offered when I log in. It took me three days to even find that the > environment existed! Now I am actually using the latest version, > though it took me more than a week to learn how to load and run this. I don't know if this functionality also works with ACL Security, probably not. In the Unix Security you need to log-in as a super-user and then the environment (that is hidden trough a hider-decoration) magically appears. The code doing this is the following: PRContext>>setUser: aUser self propertyAt: #user put: aUser. self enumerator hidden: (aUser notNil and: [ aUser isSuperuser ]) The enumerator in the context is a default visitor that knows how to traverse Pier. If you set #hidden: to true it also visits hidden structures, else they are simply ignored. Menus are rendered using this default enumerator. >> if you directly type the path to the environment (older versions) >> you are able to simply edit those things from within your Web >> browser. Lukas > > I do understand that you are able to do this. Thats what I did in > order to reverse engineer the code to put into > environmentStructure. Although pier is very tightly and cleanly > architected, I think that am at a different stage in the process. I > feel that my contribution is part of the process of making things > more usable for the uninitiated. I have the benefit of not knowing > anything about pier and having to learn it all from scratch. Even though you can't see the environment, everybody is able to see the environment by directly typing the URL. Of course this can also be prevented using one of the security frameworks. As an example and to prove that this works, try to go to the environment of my homepage by browsing to . > So I am taking a look at the raw features that pier has and putting > them into a context for the new users, specifically power users, > who need meta-tools. The old environment is simply a tool for > editing one thing, the layout. My implementation of environment has/ > will become a development space for new layouts, styles and > everything else which I dont think really had a place before. You > are correct you can directly edit a sub-component by entering the > direct url. But I ask the question, how do you learn how to do this > if no one has told you, it has to be really obvious. I also think > that it is best to get things to a point where the out of the box > experience as easy to learn as possible, but we dont want to > clutter up the main user wiki content with this stuff, which is > what wiki's always used to do. Yes, I completely agree. That's why I tried to make hidden structures visible for super-users, I don't know why it didn't work in your case. Maybe the default Pier setup should include a better introduction and a how-to for the most common functionalities. Right now a non-programmer is simply lost. > You may not see the need to mark the hard wired things. But for me > they are a useful hook for learning things, particularly if you > want to tweak things, which is where learning things often starts > for me. Sure, the problem is I don't like flags in the code ;-) Some of things you labelled as hard wired are not hard wired, these are just default values that can be changed trough the web-interface. Something totally unrelated, just to write it down: it would be cool to have sort of a tagging system in Smalltalk, so that one could associate tags with classes, methods, instance variables, etc. Then we could get rid of the categories and all the flags and one could simply open a browser on all entities tagged as "hard wired", or on all classes tagged as "document" and "visitor" displaying the PRDocumentVisitor class ... > On reflection it looks like the direction this is leading to is to > refactor all of the environment stuff, and some of the pierconfig > stuff out of PRStructure into a separate extension module. For want > of a better name "PREnvironment" and sons. > > This would allow Environments (i.e. the out of the box style and > configuration) to be selected in the seaside configuration panel, > and offer a creative outlet for users to produce a range of pre- > configured environments. This becomes the natural starting point > for new 'power' users to begin creating bespoke environments, while > allowing the core of pier to remain lean and fit. For #icon and #label this would be a good idea, else I don't really see the point. The environment is instantiated once when you set up the server, after that it doesn't need that code anymore. This is just a template to get users started from. To have the choice between different ready-made templates I created a small command with less than 30 lines of code. See Pier-Environment- lr.1 in the Pier repository. It has 3 slightly different templates defined on the class-side, that can be applied from the web-interface anywhere inside Pier. Does this help? Do you think that should go into the core? Cheers, Lukas -- Lukas Renggli http://www.lukas-renggli.ch From keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk Sat Jun 10 18:36:22 2006 From: keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk (Keith Hodges) Date: Sat, 10 Jun 2006 17:36:22 +0100 Subject: [Smallwiki] Upgrade to the environment In-Reply-To: <1EBCABDB-C763-43C4-BC22-F40F7DCAC4EE@iam.unibe.ch> References: <4489584B.6030306@yahoo.co.uk> <44895B55.1030204@yahoo.co.uk> <448A1ED8.90507@yahoo.co.uk> <1EBCABDB-C763-43C4-BC22-F40F7DCAC4EE@iam.unibe.ch> Message-ID: <448AF506.4090806@yahoo.co.uk> Lukas, Ooh, it does work after all. Not knowing this I had taken the law into my own hands and removed the hider manually which explains why it didnt work for me! Keith > I don't know if this functionality also works with ACL Security, > probably not. In the Unix Security you need to log-in as a super-user > and then the environment (that is hidden trough a hider-decoration) > magically appears. The code doing this is the following: > > PRContext>>setUser: aUser > self propertyAt: #user put: aUser. > self enumerator hidden: (aUser notNil > and: [ aUser isSuperuser ]) > > The enumerator in the context is a default visitor that knows how to > traverse Pier. If you set #hidden: to true it also visits hidden > structures, else they are simply ignored. Menus are rendered using > this default enumerator. > ___________________________________________________________ All new Yahoo! Mail "The new Interface is stunning in its simplicity and ease of use." - PC Magazine http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html From keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk Mon Jun 12 01:55:22 2006 From: keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk (Keith Hodges) Date: Mon, 12 Jun 2006 00:55:22 +0100 Subject: [Smallwiki] Upgrade to the environment In-Reply-To: <1EBCABDB-C763-43C4-BC22-F40F7DCAC4EE@iam.unibe.ch> References: <4489584B.6030306@yahoo.co.uk> <44895B55.1030204@yahoo.co.uk> <448A1ED8.90507@yahoo.co.uk> <1EBCABDB-C763-43C4-BC22-F40F7DCAC4EE@iam.unibe.ch> Message-ID: <448CAD6A.9040603@yahoo.co.uk> > Sure, the problem is I don't like flags in the code ;-) > I see! > Some of things you labelled as hard wired are not hard wired, these > are just default values that can be changed trough the web-interface. > > > Something totally unrelated, just to write it down: it would be cool > to have sort of a tagging system in Smalltalk, so that one could > associate tags with classes, methods, instance variables, etc. Then > we could get rid of the categories and all the flags and one could > simply open a browser on all entities tagged as "hard wired", or on > all classes tagged as "document" and "visitor" displaying the > PRDocumentVisitor class ... > > I am not sure if I remember rightly, but wasn't this what the developer of starbrowser had in mind too? >> On reflection it looks like the direction this is leading to is to >> refactor all of the environment stuff, and some of the pierconfig >> stuff out of PRStructure into a separate extension module. For want >> of a better name "PREnvironment" and sons. >> >> This would allow Environments (i.e. the out of the box style and >> configuration) to be selected in the seaside configuration panel, >> and offer a creative outlet for users to produce a range of pre- >> configured environments. This becomes the natural starting point >> for new 'power' users to begin creating bespoke environments, while >> allowing the core of pier to remain lean and fit. >> > > For #icon and #label this would be a good idea, else I don't really > see the point. The environment is instantiated once when you set up > I see your point... but I am leaning in the direction of doing a whole lot more with the environement concept so I guess I just have to try it out and see. > To have the choice between different ready-made templates I created a > small command with less than 30 lines of code. See Pier-Environment- > lr.1 in the Pier repository. It has 3 slightly different templates > defined on the class-side, that can be applied from the web-interface > anywhere inside Pier. Does this help? Do you think that should go > into the core? > Its certainly nice to have around as an example, and I think that having a Pier-Environment space on the server for such things is a great idea. do you open your source server for contibutions? Keith ___________________________________________________________ All new Yahoo! Mail "The new Interface is stunning in its simplicity and ease of use." - PC Magazine http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html From renggli at iam.unibe.ch Mon Jun 12 06:54:32 2006 From: renggli at iam.unibe.ch (Lukas Renggli) Date: Mon, 12 Jun 2006 06:54:32 +0200 Subject: [Smallwiki] Upgrade to the environment In-Reply-To: <448CAD6A.9040603@yahoo.co.uk> References: <4489584B.6030306@yahoo.co.uk> <44895B55.1030204@yahoo.co.uk> <448A1ED8.90507@yahoo.co.uk> <1EBCABDB-C763-43C4-BC22-F40F7DCAC4EE@iam.unibe.ch> <448CAD6A.9040603@yahoo.co.uk> Message-ID: <297D81CF-3E04-4779-BA06-9912DAAF20E9@iam.unibe.ch> > Its certainly nice to have around as an example, and I think that > having > a Pier-Environment space on the server for such things is a great > idea. > > do you open your source server for contibutions? Yes sure, the projects Pier and Magritte are now repositories writeable by everybody. Everybody feel free to commit changes, enhancements, fixes, etc. Cheers, Lukas -- Lukas Renggli http://www.lukas-renggli.ch From damien.pollet at gmail.com Mon Jun 12 21:28:14 2006 From: damien.pollet at gmail.com (Damien Pollet) Date: Mon, 12 Jun 2006 21:28:14 +0200 Subject: Loading latest Magritte fails, understanding MC Message-ID: <34b4844b0606121228p2f234826m324f2753ac3e403f@mail.gmail.com> MessageNotUnderstood: MACachedBuilder>>modified: When loading Magritte-Model-lr.219.mcz ... Also, coming from the CVS/SVN kind of version control systems, I'm quite troubled by MC... - Is there a specific order to load package versions ? - are there dependancies between versions ? - what is the equivalent of apt-get update && apt-get -f dist-upgrade ? Stef, I think I need a day-to-day-Squeak tutorial :) -- Damien Pollet type less, do more From damien.pollet at gmail.com Mon Jun 12 21:30:50 2006 From: damien.pollet at gmail.com (Damien Pollet) Date: Mon, 12 Jun 2006 21:30:50 +0200 Subject: Loading latest Magritte fails, understanding MC In-Reply-To: <34b4844b0606121228p2f234826m324f2753ac3e403f@mail.gmail.com> References: <34b4844b0606121228p2f234826m324f2753ac3e403f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <34b4844b0606121230j7991e8a5uef41a401da8ffccb@mail.gmail.com> > When loading Magritte-Model-lr.219.mcz ... Actually I could load up until 195, 196 pops that MNU message -- Damien Pollet type less, do more From keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk Mon Jun 12 22:33:05 2006 From: keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk (Keith Hodges) Date: Mon, 12 Jun 2006 21:33:05 +0100 Subject: Why don't you document what this software is? WHAT DOES IT DO? In-Reply-To: <448388D0.8060009@yahoo.co.uk> References: <4483818F.20201@warwick.ac.uk> <448388D0.8060009@yahoo.co.uk> Message-ID: <448DCF81.7070208@yahoo.co.uk> This comment appeared on the scg smallwiki pier site. I do have to say I sympathise. The majority of squeak projects are referred to without sufficient context. As a recent example on the squeak list, 'hobbes' was talked about with much enthusiasm without any reference to what it actually was! Anyhow back to the topic, perhaps pier needs some marketing speak. Mission statement, tag lines etc. best regards Keith ___________________________________________________________ Copy addresses and emails from any email account to Yahoo! Mail - quick, easy and free. http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/trueswitch2.html From renggli at iam.unibe.ch Tue Jun 13 00:31:51 2006 From: renggli at iam.unibe.ch (Lukas Renggli) Date: Tue, 13 Jun 2006 00:31:51 +0200 Subject: Why don't you document what this software is? WHAT DOES IT DO? In-Reply-To: <448DCF81.7070208@yahoo.co.uk> References: <4483818F.20201@warwick.ac.uk> <448388D0.8060009@yahoo.co.uk> <448DCF81.7070208@yahoo.co.uk> Message-ID: <1B8FA3D1-83B6-44B5-BD4D-243C833F6949@iam.unibe.ch> > This comment appeared on the scg smallwiki pier site. I do have to > say I > sympathise. The majority of squeak projects are referred to without > sufficient context. As a recent example on the squeak list, > 'hobbes' was > talked about with much enthusiasm without any reference to what it > actually was! Hobbes is a VM written in Smalltalk being able to simulate the original Smalltalk-80 images: > Anyhow back to the topic, perhaps pier needs some marketing speak. > Mission statement, tag lines etc. I completely agree, however -- as it is in the open source world -- everybody is invited to contribute: the code repositories are open to commit, the wikis are writable for public, there are slides on my homepage to give presentations, etc. Cheers, Lukas -- Lukas Renggli http://www.lukas-renggli.ch From renggli at iam.unibe.ch Tue Jun 13 00:42:53 2006 From: renggli at iam.unibe.ch (Lukas Renggli) Date: Tue, 13 Jun 2006 00:42:53 +0200 Subject: Loading latest Magritte fails, understanding MC In-Reply-To: <34b4844b0606121228p2f234826m324f2753ac3e403f@mail.gmail.com> References: <34b4844b0606121228p2f234826m324f2753ac3e403f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <837EAE97-8131-4D41-8F2E-E3CE63FB692E@iam.unibe.ch> > MessageNotUnderstood: MACachedBuilder>>modified: > > When loading Magritte-Model-lr.219.mcz ... Some versions I publish break backward compatibility, even-tough I try to avoid that as much as possible. If there is no other clean way to do it, then I usually give detailled instructions in the mailing list how to migrate: See the following URL for your particular problem: > Also, coming from the CVS/SVN kind of version control systems, I'm > quite troubled by MC... > - Is there a specific order to load package versions ? For my projects it is always the same: model first, view next, and at last the tests. So for Magritte the order would be: Magritte-Model, Magritte-Seaside, Magritte-Morph, Magritte-Tests. > - are there dependancies between versions ? Yes, but Monticello is not really able to model that. See the dependencies of the empty package Magritte-All for snapshot from my image. Usually it is a good practice to simply load the latest versions, or maybe in your case load the version from SqueakMap. > - what is the equivalent of apt-get update && apt-get -f dist- > upgrade ? Sorry, I only know "emerge sync && emerge -uD world" ;-) Cheers, Lukas -- Lukas Renggli http://www.lukas-renggli.ch From damien.pollet at gmail.com Tue Jun 13 10:27:43 2006 From: damien.pollet at gmail.com (Damien Pollet) Date: Tue, 13 Jun 2006 10:27:43 +0200 Subject: Loading latest Magritte fails, understanding MC In-Reply-To: <837EAE97-8131-4D41-8F2E-E3CE63FB692E@iam.unibe.ch> References: <34b4844b0606121228p2f234826m324f2753ac3e403f@mail.gmail.com> <837EAE97-8131-4D41-8F2E-E3CE63FB692E@iam.unibe.ch> Message-ID: <34b4844b0606130127j61839542j34e58d8c61ed7737@mail.gmail.com> > Well, I still get the MNU from AnObsoleteMAMethodBuilder... > For my projects it is always the same: model first, view next, and at What happens if break that order ? > > - are there dependancies between versions ? > > Yes, but Monticello is not really able to model that. See the > dependencies of the empty package Magritte-All for snapshot from my > image. Usually it is a good practice to simply load the latest > versions, or maybe in your case load the version from SqueakMap. > > > - what is the equivalent of apt-get update && apt-get -f dist- > > upgrade ? > > Sorry, I only know "emerge sync && emerge -uD world" ;-) I got sick of portage dying after 45mins of sync'ing :P -- Damien Pollet type less, do more From renggli at iam.unibe.ch Tue Jun 13 13:24:34 2006 From: renggli at iam.unibe.ch (Lukas Renggli) Date: Tue, 13 Jun 2006 13:24:34 +0200 Subject: Loading latest Magritte fails, understanding MC In-Reply-To: <34b4844b0606130127j61839542j34e58d8c61ed7737@mail.gmail.com> References: <34b4844b0606121228p2f234826m324f2753ac3e403f@mail.gmail.com> <837EAE97-8131-4D41-8F2E-E3CE63FB692E@iam.unibe.ch> <34b4844b0606130127j61839542j34e58d8c61ed7737@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <3B88A9B9-B041-4D1A-95A9-ED9601761B3A@iam.unibe.ch> >> > > Well, I still get the MNU from AnObsoleteMAMethodBuilder... Yeah, you have to do that *before* you load the new implementation. You image has now a broken change-notification that you need to fix manually :-/ >> For my projects it is always the same: model first, view next, and at > > What happens if break that order ? If you load them in the wrong order into a fresh image Monticello will complain about missing classes and not allow to load the code. For a working image with older versions loaded it will probably just work, of course this depends on the actual changes. Check-out the Monticello and Squeak Mailing Lists to learn about Squeak packaging and versioning. Lukas -- Lukas Renggli http://www.lukas-renggli.ch From damien.pollet at gmail.com Tue Jun 13 13:37:28 2006 From: damien.pollet at gmail.com (Damien Pollet) Date: Tue, 13 Jun 2006 13:37:28 +0200 Subject: Loading latest Magritte fails, understanding MC In-Reply-To: <3B88A9B9-B041-4D1A-95A9-ED9601761B3A@iam.unibe.ch> References: <34b4844b0606121228p2f234826m324f2753ac3e403f@mail.gmail.com> <837EAE97-8131-4D41-8F2E-E3CE63FB692E@iam.unibe.ch> <34b4844b0606130127j61839542j34e58d8c61ed7737@mail.gmail.com> <3B88A9B9-B041-4D1A-95A9-ED9601761B3A@iam.unibe.ch> Message-ID: <34b4844b0606130437o73b9a29j2ab007441f8e86dc@mail.gmail.com> On 6/13/06, Lukas Renggli wrote: > Yeah, you have to do that *before* you load the new implementation. > You image has now a broken change-notification that you need to fix > manually :-/ I guess I better extract my changes and put them back in a fresh image (or start from scratch even)... -- Damien Pollet type less, do more From keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk Tue Jun 13 16:10:35 2006 From: keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk (Keith Hodges) Date: Tue, 13 Jun 2006 15:10:35 +0100 Subject: [Smallwiki] Re: http://www.logowiki.net In-Reply-To: <7547a9ff0604190715n28df6529x843c9c262a520844@mail.gmail.com> References: <7547a9ff0604190715n28df6529x843c9c262a520844@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <448EC75B.1050901@yahoo.co.uk> Error: There is no free space in this set! I got this error when attempting to add a page any ideas? Keith ___________________________________________________________ Try the all-new Yahoo! Mail. "The New Version is radically easier to use" ? The Wall Street Journal http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html From keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk Tue Jun 13 16:22:00 2006 From: keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk (Keith Hodges) Date: Tue, 13 Jun 2006 15:22:00 +0100 Subject: No free space in set Message-ID: <448ECA08.9090307@yahoo.co.uk> (sorry wrong thread) Error: There is no free space in this set! I got this error when attempting to add a page any ideas? Keith ___________________________________________________________ The all-new Yahoo! Mail goes wherever you go - free your email address from your Internet provider. http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html From keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk Tue Jun 13 16:34:04 2006 From: keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk (Keith Hodges) Date: Tue, 13 Jun 2006 15:34:04 +0100 Subject: [Smallwiki] No free space in set In-Reply-To: <448ECA08.9090307@yahoo.co.uk> References: <448ECA08.9090307@yahoo.co.uk> Message-ID: <448ECCDC.3010805@yahoo.co.uk> and inspecting that set the tally was 0, looking at the code for set it seems quite difficult for this to occur since I do not see Pier doing anything out of the ordinary. Is this a wider issue? Doing a grow and fullCheck on it returned the tally to 6. Keith ___________________________________________________________ Try the all-new Yahoo! Mail. "The New Version is radically easier to use" ? The Wall Street Journal http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html From renggli at iam.unibe.ch Tue Jun 13 17:50:25 2006 From: renggli at iam.unibe.ch (Lukas Renggli) Date: Tue, 13 Jun 2006 17:50:25 +0200 Subject: [Smallwiki] No free space in set In-Reply-To: <448ECCDC.3010805@yahoo.co.uk> References: <448ECA08.9090307@yahoo.co.uk> <448ECCDC.3010805@yahoo.co.uk> Message-ID: <9893DE53-4BC3-4CA8-A987-6593D5D7A53B@iam.unibe.ch> > and inspecting that set the tally was 0, looking at the code for > set it > seems quite difficult for this to occur since I do not see Pier doing > anything out of the ordinary. Is this a wider issue? Doing a grow and > fullCheck on it returned the tally to 6. This is very strange, it never happened to me. You might want to file a bug to bugs.impara.de, if you can reproduce this problem. Cheers, Lukas -- Lukas Renggli http://www.lukas-renggli.ch From keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk Tue Jun 13 19:41:28 2006 From: keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk (Keith Hodges) Date: Tue, 13 Jun 2006 18:41:28 +0100 Subject: [Smallwiki] No free space in set In-Reply-To: <9893DE53-4BC3-4CA8-A987-6593D5D7A53B@iam.unibe.ch> References: <448ECA08.9090307@yahoo.co.uk> <448ECCDC.3010805@yahoo.co.uk> <9893DE53-4BC3-4CA8-A987-6593D5D7A53B@iam.unibe.ch> Message-ID: <448EF8C8.3070409@yahoo.co.uk> I was showing someone pier yesterday to a non computer user and it happened almost straight away (murphys law) This happened once more in the same image - it may be an anomaly Keith >> and inspecting that set the tally was 0, looking at the code for >> set it >> seems quite difficult for this to occur since I do not see Pier doing >> anything out of the ordinary. Is this a wider issue? Doing a grow and >> fullCheck on it returned the tally to 6. >> > > This is very strange, it never happened to me. You might want to file > a bug to bugs.impara.de, if you can reproduce this problem. > > Cheers, > Lukas > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.iam.unibe.ch/pipermail/smallwiki/attachments/20060613/fceab1fc/attachment.html From keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk Wed Jun 14 02:12:59 2006 From: keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk (Keith Hodges) Date: Wed, 14 Jun 2006 01:12:59 +0100 Subject: Stylesheets in Pier demo In-Reply-To: <66666f210606131119k71e8d950h661e00eb0210ccbc@mail.gmail.com> References: <448EB3C8.3090806@yahoo.co.uk> <448EB750.7060104@archonet.com> <448EC3A6.9030702@yahoo.co.uk> <66666f210606131119k71e8d950h661e00eb0210ccbc@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <448F548B.1070908@yahoo.co.uk> (repost) Perhaps you would be interested to take a look at the first shot of my approach to handling styles entirely within pier. As a first go, it may have some rough edges but let me know what you think of the concept. http://create.seasidehosting.st you may login as per normal to have a look around. ---- 1. I moved the layout from "/environment" to "/environment/layout" which frees up "/environment" for some contextual information, instructions and presentation of environment features, which now include a stylesheet, and color tables. (I think that a user manager should go in here also, so as to avoid cluttering up the rest of the interface. A save image (copy) action button might be a useful administrative tool which could go in here too) 2. I wrote a visitor that collects the text in a page, includes the content text of any embedded pages, and inserts a url for any embedded images. This is used beginning at "/environment/stylesheet/main", and the visitor assembles a stylesheet. Embedded text pages can be used as variables (see see "/environment/colors" ). 3. The stylesheet is collated into the htmlRoot by PRPierFrame, which currently has things like environmentSelector, layoutSelector, stylePageSelector, hard coded. The plan is to take all of this configuration and refactor it into a decorator (PRManager and sons). The PRPierDefaultEnvironmentManager decorator is applied to the root page by default, and it uses this to tell where to find its environment (because when localized it might be called something else). 4. (planned) PRManagers may be applied to any page in the wiki tree to override styles and layouts for siblings. Sibling environments should only need to modify bits of the environment since they are inherited from the parent environment. PRManagers will be able to do lots of other useful functions, such as maintaining an alias list, colour -> color, for example, or managing the "new page as sibling", "new page as child" policies. I haven't made any effort to present the stylesheet correctly, at the moment it is at the mercy of wiki syntax when displayed. (hence comments are spread across two lines to avoid double stars /*not a link*/ being interpreted as links) I have a notion of micro content (which I implemented in a thing called tiddlypom) where sub parts of a page are marked and tagged. They may even use different parsers. With this in place, the stylesheet information could be a subpart of a page (what I call a "tiddle") with its own non-wiki-syntax parser. And colors could be listed in a single page because links such as "/environment/colors//broken" would resolve to a marked "tiddle" part of the "/environment/colors" page. I am really impressed with seaside and pier too now I have had a chance to get my teeth into it. best regards Keith ___________________________________________________________ The all-new Yahoo! Mail goes wherever you go - free your email address from your Internet provider. http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html From renggli at iam.unibe.ch Wed Jun 14 07:20:07 2006 From: renggli at iam.unibe.ch (Lukas Renggli) Date: Wed, 14 Jun 2006 07:20:07 +0200 Subject: Stylesheets in Pier demo In-Reply-To: <448F548B.1070908@yahoo.co.uk> References: <448EB3C8.3090806@yahoo.co.uk> <448EB750.7060104@archonet.com> <448EC3A6.9030702@yahoo.co.uk> <66666f210606131119k71e8d950h661e00eb0210ccbc@mail.gmail.com> <448F548B.1070908@yahoo.co.uk> Message-ID: <2F17DCCE-B18C-4180-AE7A-E4E992AF6C5A@iam.unibe.ch> > 1. I moved the layout from "/environment" to "/environment/layout" > which > frees up "/environment" for some contextual information, instructions > and presentation of environment features, which now include a > stylesheet, and color tables. > (I think that a user manager should go in here also, so as to avoid > cluttering up the rest of the interface. A save image (copy) action > button might be a useful administrative tool which could go in here > too) I very much like the color tables. Great idea! > PRManagers will be able to do lots of other useful functions, such as > maintaining an alias list, colour -> color, for example, or > managing the > "new page as sibling", "new page as child" policies. Great, I am looking forward to see all those management tools appearing. Cheers, Lukas -- Lukas Renggli http://www.lukas-renggli.ch From keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk Wed Jun 14 13:39:30 2006 From: keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk (Keith Hodges) Date: Wed, 14 Jun 2006 12:39:30 +0100 Subject: [Smallwiki] Re: Stylesheets in Pier demo In-Reply-To: <2F17DCCE-B18C-4180-AE7A-E4E992AF6C5A@iam.unibe.ch> References: <448EB3C8.3090806@yahoo.co.uk> <448EB750.7060104@archonet.com> <448EC3A6.9030702@yahoo.co.uk> <66666f210606131119k71e8d950h661e00eb0210ccbc@mail.gmail.com> <448F548B.1070908@yahoo.co.uk> <2F17DCCE-B18C-4180-AE7A-E4E992AF6C5A@iam.unibe.ch> Message-ID: <448FF572.8000005@yahoo.co.uk> > I very much like the color tables. Great idea! > > Thank you, we just need squeak to re-render the images with a color-table defined color on demand! I'll bet that there arent many cms frameworks capable of that. Keith ___________________________________________________________ All new Yahoo! Mail "The new Interface is stunning in its simplicity and ease of use." - PC Magazine http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html From damien.pollet at gmail.com Wed Jun 14 18:57:50 2006 From: damien.pollet at gmail.com (Damien Pollet) Date: Wed, 14 Jun 2006 18:57:50 +0200 Subject: Loading latest Magritte fails, understanding MC In-Reply-To: <34b4844b0606130437o73b9a29j2ab007441f8e86dc@mail.gmail.com> References: <34b4844b0606121228p2f234826m324f2753ac3e403f@mail.gmail.com> <837EAE97-8131-4D41-8F2E-E3CE63FB692E@iam.unibe.ch> <34b4844b0606130127j61839542j34e58d8c61ed7737@mail.gmail.com> <3B88A9B9-B041-4D1A-95A9-ED9601761B3A@iam.unibe.ch> <34b4844b0606130437o73b9a29j2ab007441f8e86dc@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <34b4844b0606140957j7f5289efmb8fa88d087f9dd1@mail.gmail.com> > I guess I better extract my changes and put them back in a fresh image > (or start from scratch even)... Well I did that, and applied the MADescriptionBuilder initialize. trick found on this list, but I get MessageNotUnderstood: WAAnchorTag>>accessKey: SqueakSource is dead so I can't try to update seaside (I have 2.6a3 from SM, isn't that the latest ? -- Damien Pollet type less, do more From damien.pollet at gmail.com Fri Jun 16 16:42:51 2006 From: damien.pollet at gmail.com (Damien Pollet) Date: Fri, 16 Jun 2006 16:42:51 +0200 Subject: Finding my way in Pier's code In-Reply-To: <3D229E12-3555-4B10-83F8-48283ADEFFF6@iam.unibe.ch> References: <34b4844b0605211318t58fb5cc4i68d52fe3a8345102@mail.gmail.com> <3D229E12-3555-4B10-83F8-48283ADEFFF6@iam.unibe.ch> Message-ID: <34b4844b0606160742h7f539879jbc754203c05f2fef@mail.gmail.com> On 5/22/06, Lukas Renggli wrote: > If you have a solution (not necessarily with the same design, but at > least with the same functionality) that works in IE, Firefox and > Safari I am very interested to include it into the main distribution. Bugzilla's page looks very much like Pier (or maybe vice-versa :p) and they use
s http://www.bugzilla.org/ What do you mean by 'functionality' ? -- Damien Pollet type less, do more From keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk Thu Jun 22 03:09:39 2006 From: keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk (Keith Hodges) Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2006 02:09:39 +0100 Subject: users/groups UI Message-ID: <4499EDD3.5080203@yahoo.co.uk> a first attempt Name: Pier-Security-kph.33 Author: kph Time: 22 June 2006, 2:03:14 am UUID: 4efb7bda-2fd7-b04d-8858-41ae19a61f37 Ancestors: Pier-Security-lr.32 Added Pier Widget for User/group management ___________________________________________________________ Try the all-new Yahoo! Mail. "The New Version is radically easier to use" ? The Wall Street Journal http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html From keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk Thu Jun 22 03:23:29 2006 From: keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk (Keith Hodges) Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2006 02:23:29 +0100 Subject: [Smallwiki] users/groups UI In-Reply-To: <4499EDD3.5080203@yahoo.co.uk> References: <4499EDD3.5080203@yahoo.co.uk> Message-ID: <4499F111.1090207@yahoo.co.uk> I did attempt a drag and drop version of the users and groups manager, it is included in pier-security-widgets-wip.kph.34 if anyone wishes to get it working. Keith ___________________________________________________________ Inbox full of spam? Get leading spam protection and 1GB storage with All New Yahoo! Mail. http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html From renggli at iam.unibe.ch Sun Jun 25 19:34:59 2006 From: renggli at iam.unibe.ch (Lukas Renggli) Date: Sun, 25 Jun 2006 19:34:59 +0200 Subject: users/groups UI In-Reply-To: <4499EDD3.5080203@yahoo.co.uk> References: <4499EDD3.5080203@yahoo.co.uk> Message-ID: > Name: Pier-Security-kph.33 > Author: kph > Time: 22 June 2006, 2:03:14 am > UUID: 4efb7bda-2fd7-b04d-8858-41ae19a61f37 > Ancestors: Pier-Security-lr.32 > > Added Pier Widget for User/group management Hey Keith, I am very interested in your changes. Where did you publish? Cheers, Lukas -- Lukas Renggli http://www.lukas-renggli.ch From renggli at iam.unibe.ch Sun Jun 25 19:35:15 2006 From: renggli at iam.unibe.ch (Lukas Renggli) Date: Sun, 25 Jun 2006 19:35:15 +0200 Subject: Finding my way in Pier's code In-Reply-To: <34b4844b0606160742h7f539879jbc754203c05f2fef@mail.gmail.com> References: <34b4844b0605211318t58fb5cc4i68d52fe3a8345102@mail.gmail.com> <3D229E12-3555-4B10-83F8-48283ADEFFF6@iam.unibe.ch> <34b4844b0606160742h7f539879jbc754203c05f2fef@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: >> If you have a solution (not necessarily with the same design, but at >> least with the same functionality) that works in IE, Firefox and >> Safari I am very interested to include it into the main distribution. > > Bugzilla's page looks very much like Pier (or maybe vice-versa :p) and > they use
s > http://www.bugzilla.org/ Yeah, www.mozilla.org is the place where I got the inspiration for the current design ;-) > What do you mean by 'functionality' ? I mean the same look & feel for IE, Firefox and Safari. I tried to come up with something not using tables, but it simply took me too much time to come up with a solution working on all Web Browser. I prefer to spend my time on other things, though it is certainly possible to come up with a cross browser solution using XHTML and CSS solely, for an example see my Web site. Cheers, Lukas -- Lukas Renggli http://www.lukas-renggli.ch From keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk Mon Jun 26 02:57:27 2006 From: keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk (Keith Hodges) Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2006 01:57:27 +0100 Subject: [Smallwiki] Re: users/groups UI In-Reply-To: References: <4499EDD3.5080203@yahoo.co.uk> Message-ID: <449F30F7.7000200@yahoo.co.uk> >> Added Pier Widget for User/group management >> > > Hey Keith, > > I am very interested in your changes. Where did you publish? > > Cheers, > Lukas > I probably published to the package-cache oops! Keith ___________________________________________________________ All New Yahoo! Mail ? Tired of Vi at gr@! come-ons? Let our SpamGuard protect you. http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html From keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk Tue Jun 27 01:28:57 2006 From: keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk (Keith Hodges) Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2006 00:28:57 +0100 Subject: [Smallwiki] Re: users/groups UI In-Reply-To: <449F30F7.7000200@yahoo.co.uk> References: <4499EDD3.5080203@yahoo.co.uk> <449F30F7.7000200@yahoo.co.uk> Message-ID: <44A06DB9.6020906@yahoo.co.uk> Dear Lukas, I have now published to the repository. My aim is to put these tools in the improved environment which I was proposing. Keith ___________________________________________________________ All New Yahoo! Mail ? Tired of Vi at gr@! come-ons? Let our SpamGuard protect you. http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html From keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk Tue Jun 27 03:48:58 2006 From: keith_hodges at yahoo.co.uk (Keith Hodges) Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2006 02:48:58 +0100 Subject: [Smallwiki] Re: users/groups UI In-Reply-To: <44A06DB9.6020906@yahoo.co.uk> References: <4499EDD3.5080203@yahoo.co.uk> <449F30F7.7000200@yahoo.co.uk> <44A06DB9.6020906@yahoo.co.uk> Message-ID: <44A08E8A.10805@yahoo.co.uk> In this Users and Groups management tool I was thinking of granting all members of the admin group superuser status. Is that a good idea or not? Keith ___________________________________________________________ The all-new Yahoo! Mail goes wherever you go - free your email address from your Internet provider. http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html