From renggli at iam.unibe.ch  Sat Dec  4 20:51:34 2004
From: renggli at iam.unibe.ch (Lukas Renggli)
Date: Sat, 4 Dec 2004 20:51:34 +0100
Subject: TextAreaField
Message-ID: <E6E21F20-462D-11D9-957A-000393CFE6C8@iam.unibe.ch>



Hi Gabriel,

please ask such question to the mailing-list and they will be answered 
much faster!

> insert a simple TextAreaField and i don't know how.
> Can you help me??

Well, what do you want to do with a TextAreaField?

To see the use of such an input field have a look at all the senders of 
#textAreaWithValue:callback:, especially the use in 
PageEdit>>renderDocument and in the callback example (from the 
SmallWiki Examples package).

Hope this helps,
Lukas

On Dec 3, 2004, at 19:45, Gabrielle Gigliotti wrote:

> Hello,
>
> I'm a student at the University of Bruxelles and i want to ask you a 
> little question related to the smallwiki environement.
> I would like to know how to insert a simple TextAreaField in a web 
> page.
> I've understood the notion of Folder,Page,Structure,Document etc.. but 
> i just want to insert a simple TextAreaField and i don't know how.
> Can you help me??
>
> Thanks in advance
>
> Gabriel

-- 
Lukas Renggli
http://www.lukas-renggli.ch



From ducasse at iam.unibe.ch  Wed Dec  8 13:12:20 2004
From: ducasse at iam.unibe.ch (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?st=E9phane_ducasse?=)
Date: Wed, 8 Dec 2004 13:12:20 +0100
Subject: Fwd: Squeak Wiki - hacked big time!! & continuing to be hacked
Message-ID: <68ECC645-4912-11D9-AEBC-000D932DAF46@iam.unibe.ch>





Begin forwarded message:

> From: Serge Stinckwich <Serge.Stinckwich at info.unicaen.fr>
> Date: 8 d?cembre 2004 12:20:25 GMT+01:00
> To: squeak-dev at lists.squeakfoundation.org
> Subject: Re: Squeak Wiki - hacked big time!! & continuing to be hacked
> Reply-To: The general-purpose Squeak developers list 
> <squeak-dev at lists.squeakfoundation.org>
>
> st?phane ducasse wrote:
>> Hi guys
>> just to let you know that lukas is working on a brand new 
>> implementation of smallwiki which is seaside based and
>> developed now in Squeak. So this means that in the future you will be 
>> able to totally and easily customize wikis with
>> advanced components. We are currently thinking about the security 
>> policies that we would like to have.
>> We plan to have advanced management tools (such as getting all the 
>> pages recently modified, freese versions.....)
>> But for the immediate problem we have we do not easy answer.
>
> Usually, the WikiSpam is only links spam in order to increase the page 
> ranking of sites.
> One way to solve the problem, already in used by several WikiEngine is 
> to use a BadContent page with a list of all banned URLs for the Wiki.
> The URLs banned are no more rendered and this BadContent can be shared 
> among several wikis.
>
> Look at how it works in MoinMoin for example : 
> http://moinmoin.wikiwikiweb.de:8000/AntiSpamGlobalSolution
> and its BadContent page :
> http://moinmaster.wikiwikiweb.de/BadContent
>
> --                                                         oooo
> Dr. Serge Stinckwich                                     OOOOOOOO
> Universit? de Caen>CNRS UMR 6072>GREYC>MAD               OOESUGOO
> http://purl.org/net/SergeStinckwich                       oooooo
> Smalltalkers do: [:it | All with: Class, (And love: it)]   \  /
>                                                             ##
>
>
>
>
>



From chris at chrisburkert.de  Wed Dec  8 19:00:23 2004
From: chris at chrisburkert.de (Chris Burkert)
Date: Wed, 08 Dec 2004 19:00:23 +0100
Subject: SmallWiki 0.9.53 porting feedback
Message-ID: <41B74137.4000705@chrisburkert.de>

Hi,

I finally found the time to port the last SmallWiki (0.9.53) to squeak 
(3.6). It is available on SqueakMap. It would be fine to get feedback 
about bugs! I know that there are some, but I can't search all day long :-)

To do this port I have gone a complete different way according to the 
following procedure:

VisualWorks
- load SW into a clean VisualWorks Image so that it would run
- load Fileout30 and enable it in the Settings Manager
- load SW-Patch.ws (attached) which creates a fileout with some patches

Squeak 3.6
- load the fileout
- load the Patch Unnamed2.29.cs (attached)
- compile a new SWWikiParser and SWWikiScanner
- run the tests

Because of this new procedure, it may not be compatible with older 
versions for squeak where I once did a port using rosetta and then 
merging all changes by hand.

While doing the whole thing I stumbled over many things that you should 
keep in mind when doing SmallWiki 2 (Remember that I don't want to 
offend you! This should be constructive criticism!):

- Do not do something like in AbstractExternalLinkChecker ... this
   is really really bad! Move #isLinkBroken: as 'self
   subclassResponsibility' to SmallWiki.Server class and implement a
   specific Version in SwazooServer class.
- Do not rely on class names! Remember in squeak we have no
   namespaces, so we have to rename all classes to 'SW', class name.
   See also SW-Patch.ws for my rename automatism.
- Use meaningful categories for classes. In squeak we have no Store,
   no Bundles and no Parcels. We have just categories which should
   name like 'SmallWiki-<aSubCategory>-<aSubSubCategory>'.
   See also SW-Patch.ws for a rename automatism.
- Do not use underscores in methodnames! Do not ever think about it!
   In squeak _ is :=.
   See also SW-Patch.ws for those methods.
- Do not use Namespace.Class in classes in the same Namespace.

Regards
            Chris Burkert
-- 
http://www.chrisburkert.de/
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From renggli at iam.unibe.ch  Wed Dec  8 20:03:32 2004
From: renggli at iam.unibe.ch (Lukas Renggli)
Date: Wed, 8 Dec 2004 20:03:32 +0100
Subject: [ANN] SmallWiki 2 and Squeak
In-Reply-To: <41B74137.4000705@chrisburkert.de>
References: <41B74137.4000705@chrisburkert.de>
Message-ID: <DAE994EE-494B-11D9-B168-000393CFE6C8@iam.unibe.ch>



Chris, don't worry about porting issues with SmallWiki 2. Thanks for 
all your work on SmallWiki 1!

I will officially announce now that we are developing SmallWiki 2 is 
Squeak, with Seaside as default view and GOODS as default backend.

The main reason for this change are the followings:

- The VisualWorks license sucks. Lots of people are unable to run 
SmallWiki on their servers simply because they would need to buy a 
Cincom license. I don't know why Bottom Feeder doesn't has this issue?

- Squeak and its libraries are all open-source. The latest 
implementations of Seaside and GOODS are always at your fingertips. As 
versioning system we are using Monticello that is more advanced and 
much faster than StORE. Squeak can be easily run headless (even with a 
VNC server running within the image itself) on any machine.

- Porting back SmallWiki 2 to VisualWorks should be very easy, as there 
is an excellent port of Seaside by Michel Bany, adding also a lot of 
methods that are commonly used in Squeak.

- Traits could help a lot avoiding code duplication and with the 
flattening property it is no problem to keep compatibility with other 
Smalltalks.

Cheers,
Lukas

-- 
Lukas Renggli
http://www.lukas-renggli.ch



From chris at chrisburkert.de  Wed Dec  8 23:42:35 2004
From: chris at chrisburkert.de (Chris Burkert)
Date: Wed, 08 Dec 2004 23:42:35 +0100
Subject: [ANN] SmallWiki 2 and Squeak
In-Reply-To: <DAE994EE-494B-11D9-B168-000393CFE6C8@iam.unibe.ch>
References: <41B74137.4000705@chrisburkert.de> <DAE994EE-494B-11D9-B168-000393CFE6C8@iam.unibe.ch>
Message-ID: <41B7835B.2040802@chrisburkert.de>



Lukas Renggli wrote:
> I will officially announce now that we are developing SmallWiki 2 is 
> Squeak, with Seaside as default view and GOODS as default backend.

This is great news ... and less work for me :-) I'm looking forward to it!

I have just published a second release of SmallWiki 0.9.53 on SqueakMap. 
Fixed some bugs and cleaned the code. Would be nice if some of you could 
test it.

regards
            Chris Burkert

PS: Maybe Magma could be another cool backend next to GOODS
-- 
http://www.chrisburkert.de/



From bergel at iam.unibe.ch  Thu Dec  9 10:08:51 2004
From: bergel at iam.unibe.ch (Alexandre Bergel)
Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 10:08:51 +0100
Subject: [ANN] SmallWiki 2 and Squeak
In-Reply-To: <41B7835B.2040802@chrisburkert.de>
References: <41B74137.4000705@chrisburkert.de> <DAE994EE-494B-11D9-B168-000393CFE6C8@iam.unibe.ch> <41B7835B.2040802@chrisburkert.de>
Message-ID: <20041209090851.GB26227@iam.unibe.ch>



I will definitely test it.
Thanks for your port.

Is the storage mechanism works in the same way than in VisualWorks?

Cheers,
Alexandre


On Wed, Dec 08, 2004 at 11:42:35PM +0100, Chris Burkert wrote:
> Lukas Renggli wrote:
> >I will officially announce now that we are developing SmallWiki 2 is 
> >Squeak, with Seaside as default view and GOODS as default backend.
> 
> This is great news ... and less work for me :-) I'm looking forward to it!
> 
> I have just published a second release of SmallWiki 0.9.53 on SqueakMap. 
> Fixed some bugs and cleaned the code. Would be nice if some of you could 
> test it.
> 
> regards
>            Chris Burkert
> 
> PS: Maybe Magma could be another cool backend next to GOODS
> -- 
> http://www.chrisburkert.de/

-- 
_,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
Alexandre Bergel  http://www.iam.unibe.ch/~bergel
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.



From charles at datasof.com  Thu Dec  9 15:09:51 2004
From: charles at datasof.com (Charles A. Monteiro)
Date: Thu, 09 Dec 2004 09:09:51 -0500
Subject: [ANN] SmallWiki 2 and Squeak
In-Reply-To: <DAE994EE-494B-11D9-B168-000393CFE6C8@iam.unibe.ch>
References: <41B74137.4000705@chrisburkert.de> <DAE994EE-494B-11D9-B168-000393CFE6C8@iam.unibe.ch>
Message-ID: <opsiquyptkf3t7b4@charles>



I am running a SmallWiki for the NYC Smalltalk user's group. I can run it  
because I am not engaging in commerce i.e. it runs on a  non-commercial  
license, to that extent it is very clear what one can and can not do. Not  
sure why you all are having such a difficulty in understanding this. If  
somebody wants to make money with SmallWiki and finds it offensive to  
share with the technology partner that creates the tools which allow one  
to run and enhance SmallWiki then said individual would have to use  
Squeak. BTW, BottomFeeder does not have "this issue" as you put it because  
it is a non-commercial product therefore it can use the "non-commercial"  
license.

VW can run headless. VisualWave servers are deployed headlessly.

I keep hearing about Monticello it would be nice to see a comparison in  
order to understand why it is more advanced than StORE.

A full copy of the email apparently does did not get sent. Is there now a  
"traits" implementation in Squeak?

Oh yes, why would one want to run a VNC server from within the Squeak  
image?

thanks

-Charles




On Wed, 8 Dec 2004 20:03:32 +0100, Lukas Renggli <renggli at iam.unibe.ch>  
wrote:

> Chris, don't worry about porting issues with SmallWiki 2. Thanks for all  
> your work on SmallWiki 1!
>
> I will officially announce now that we are developing SmallWiki 2 is  
> Squeak, with Seaside as default view and GOODS as default backend.
>
> The main reason for this change are the followings:
>
> - The VisualWorks license sucks. Lots of people are unable to run  
> SmallWiki on their servers simply because they would need to buy a  
> Cincom license. I don't know why Bottom Feeder doesn't has this issue?
>
> - Squeak and its libraries are all open-source. The latest  
> implementations of Seaside and GOODS are always at your fingertips. As  
> versioning system we are using Monticello that is more advanced and much  
> faster than StORE. Squeak can be easily run headless (even with a VNC  
> server running within the image itself) on any machine.
>
> - Porting back SmallWiki 2 to VisualWorks should be very easy, as there  
> is an excellent port of Seaside by Michel Bany, adding also a lot of  
> methods that are commonly used in Squeak.
>
> - Traits could help a lot avoiding code duplication and with the  
> flattening property it is no problem to keep compatibility with other  
> Smalltalks.
>
> Cheers,
> Lukas
>



-- 
Charles A. Monteiro



From denker at iam.unibe.ch  Thu Dec  9 15:16:48 2004
From: denker at iam.unibe.ch (Marcus Denker)
Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 15:16:48 +0100
Subject: [ANN] SmallWiki 2 and Squeak
In-Reply-To: <opsiquyptkf3t7b4@charles>
References: <41B74137.4000705@chrisburkert.de> <DAE994EE-494B-11D9-B168-000393CFE6C8@iam.unibe.ch> <opsiquyptkf3t7b4@charles>
Message-ID: <F6BCCC92-49EC-11D9-B6BB-000D93AE556A@iam.unibe.ch>




Am 09.12.2004 um 15:09 schrieb Charles A. Monteiro:

> I am running a SmallWiki for the NYC Smalltalk user's group. I can run 
> it because I am not engaging in commerce i.e. it runs on a  
> non-commercial license, to that extent it is very clear what one can 
> and can not do. Not sure why you all are having such a difficulty in 
> understanding this. If somebody wants to make money with SmallWiki and 
> finds it offensive to share with the technology partner that creates 
> the tools which allow one to run and enhance SmallWiki then said 
> individual would have to use Squeak. BTW, BottomFeeder does not have 
> "this issue" as you put it because it is a non-commercial product 
> therefore it can use the "non-commercial" license.
>
SmallWiki is a non-commercial product, too. Yet everybody *using* it in 
a commercial setting has to have a *developers* license.
We asked. This is official Cincom policy. The same is true for other 
projects, e.g. Moose and CodeCrawler.

       Marcus



From ducasse at iam.unibe.ch  Thu Dec  9 15:39:34 2004
From: ducasse at iam.unibe.ch (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?st=E9phane_ducasse?=)
Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 15:39:34 +0100
Subject: [ANN] SmallWiki 2 and Squeak
In-Reply-To: <opsiquyptkf3t7b4@charles>
References: <41B74137.4000705@chrisburkert.de> <DAE994EE-494B-11D9-B168-000393CFE6C8@iam.unibe.ch> <opsiquyptkf3t7b4@charles>
Message-ID: <250804BE-49F0-11D9-AA9F-000D932DAF46@iam.unibe.ch>



Hi charles

In fact this is a bit complex than that:
	- James said that normally if you do not ask for support you would not 
have to pay
	- I have no problem to pay for VW but others have.
	- for example this is not clear if you should pay because you use a 
wiki for a company
	if the wiki is used to get cusotmer information ....
	- we decided to move to Squeak because lukas was only developing in VW 
for SmallWiki
	(but back porting to VW is something that we will always keep in mind).
	- May be VW is better for serving than squeak but we had to try :)
	- this is true that store is a bit painful (even if the tool of MC are 
still for my taste a bit raw).
	But waiting 40 min for a merge is not possible for me.
	- We hope that more people will contribute to SmallWiki 2 :) because 
we felt a bit alone.
	- SmallWiki 2 will be more a really cool contents management system 
than a simple wiki
	so small companies may want to help and they often do not work in VW.
	- for traits they are not yet in squeak but in the pipeline for 3.9. 
But as lukas said this should not
	be a problem

I hope that this makes our move clearer but

Stef


On 9 d?c. 04, at 15:09, Charles A. Monteiro wrote:

> I am running a SmallWiki for the NYC Smalltalk user's group. I can run 
> it because I am not engaging in commerce i.e. it runs on a  
> non-commercial license, to that extent it is very clear what one can 
> and can not do. Not sure why you all are having such a difficulty in 
> understanding this. If somebody wants to make money with SmallWiki and 
> finds it offensive to share with the technology partner that creates 
> the tools which allow one to run and enhance SmallWiki then said 
> individual would have to use Squeak. BTW, BottomFeeder does not have 
> "this issue" as you put it because it is a non-commercial product 
> therefore it can use the "non-commercial" license.
>
> VW can run headless. VisualWave servers are deployed headlessly.
>
> I keep hearing about Monticello it would be nice to see a comparison 
> in order to understand why it is more advanced than StORE.
>
> A full copy of the email apparently does did not get sent. Is there 
> now a "traits" implementation in Squeak?
>
> Oh yes, why would one want to run a VNC server from within the Squeak 
> image?
>
> thanks
>
> -Charles
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, 8 Dec 2004 20:03:32 +0100, Lukas Renggli 
> <renggli at iam.unibe.ch> wrote:
>
>> Chris, don't worry about porting issues with SmallWiki 2. Thanks for 
>> all your work on SmallWiki 1!
>>
>> I will officially announce now that we are developing SmallWiki 2 is 
>> Squeak, with Seaside as default view and GOODS as default backend.
>>
>> The main reason for this change are the followings:
>>
>> - The VisualWorks license sucks. Lots of people are unable to run 
>> SmallWiki on their servers simply because they would need to buy a 
>> Cincom license. I don't know why Bottom Feeder doesn't has this 
>> issue?
>>
>> - Squeak and its libraries are all open-source. The latest 
>> implementations of Seaside and GOODS are always at your fingertips. 
>> As versioning system we are using Monticello that is more advanced 
>> and much faster than StORE. Squeak can be easily run headless (even 
>> with a VNC server running within the image itself) on any machine.
>>
>> - Porting back SmallWiki 2 to VisualWorks should be very easy, as 
>> there is an excellent port of Seaside by Michel Bany, adding also a 
>> lot of methods that are commonly used in Squeak.
>>
>> - Traits could help a lot avoiding code duplication and with the 
>> flattening property it is no problem to keep compatibility with other 
>> Smalltalks.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Lukas
>>
>
>
>
> -- 
> Charles A. Monteiro
>



From charles at datasof.com  Thu Dec  9 16:34:31 2004
From: charles at datasof.com (Charles A. Monteiro)
Date: Thu, 09 Dec 2004 10:34:31 -0500
Subject: [ANN] SmallWiki 2 and Squeak
In-Reply-To: <F6BCCC92-49EC-11D9-B6BB-000D93AE556A@iam.unibe.ch>
References: <41B74137.4000705@chrisburkert.de> <DAE994EE-494B-11D9-B168-000393CFE6C8@iam.unibe.ch> <opsiquyptkf3t7b4@charles> <F6BCCC92-49EC-11D9-B6BB-000D93AE556A@iam.unibe.ch>
Message-ID: <opsiqyvtllf3t7b4@charles>



Of course, that is what I said, if you want to make money with SmallWiki  
and don't want to share in the profits then you must use the Squeak  
version. For myself I find it perfectly natural to share my profits with a  
company who I use its products in some way. I don't like to abuse or take  
advantage of others. For most situations especially if you are a small  
company it amounts to a smaller percentage than the sales tax I have to  
pay to the state of NY i.e. worst case it probably amounts to about 6% of  
whatever item I may for example sell on my wiki. If you don't want to eat  
the 6% then pass it on to your customers, if they turn away from you for  
6% then they just did not like your product enough, unless you were  
selling multi-million dollar jet planes in which case maybe 6% starts to  
become a drag. BTW, if you are not making money then you are not in a  
"commercial" setting, you are doing R&D. Now if one is so presumptuous to  
announce to the world that your R&D is so good that it will for sure  
become a commercial product then one should pay for one's arrogance and  
possibly stupidity. Of course , if one now gets 1 million dollars in  
venture capital , forms a LLC etc then that sounds to me like a commercial  
setting. As far as the developer's license that is subtracted from your  
overall fees to Cincom. You do not need to talk to a Cincom sales rep  
until you are ready to make money. If you are a guy in a garage coding but  
you are not making money then you are not in a "commercial" setting. You  
can hope to eventually be, you can pretend with your friends that you are,  
but you are not. So don't tell Cincom that you are. Everything is  
allright. Code. When you are ready to make money, pay the people that help  
you make money their due. It is just the right thing to do.

-Charles

On Thu, 9 Dec 2004 15:16:48 +0100, Marcus Denker <denker at iam.unibe.ch>  
wrote:

>
> Am 09.12.2004 um 15:09 schrieb Charles A. Monteiro:
>
>> I am running a SmallWiki for the NYC Smalltalk user's group. I can run  
>> it because I am not engaging in commerce i.e. it runs on a   
>> non-commercial license, to that extent it is very clear what one can  
>> and can not do. Not sure why you all are having such a difficulty in  
>> understanding this. If somebody wants to make money with SmallWiki and  
>> finds it offensive to share with the technology partner that creates  
>> the tools which allow one to run and enhance SmallWiki then said  
>> individual would have to use Squeak. BTW, BottomFeeder does not have  
>> "this issue" as you put it because it is a non-commercial product  
>> therefore it can use the "non-commercial" license.
>>
> SmallWiki is a non-commercial product, too. Yet everybody *using* it in  
> a commercial setting has to have a *developers* license.
> We asked. This is official Cincom policy. The same is true for other  
> projects, e.g. Moose and CodeCrawler.
>
>        Marcus



-- 
Charles A. Monteiro



From charles at datasof.com  Thu Dec  9 16:50:08 2004
From: charles at datasof.com (Charles A. Monteiro)
Date: Thu, 09 Dec 2004 10:50:08 -0500
Subject: [ANN] SmallWiki 2 and Squeak
In-Reply-To: <250804BE-49F0-11D9-AA9F-000D932DAF46@iam.unibe.ch>
References: <41B74137.4000705@chrisburkert.de> <DAE994EE-494B-11D9-B168-000393CFE6C8@iam.unibe.ch> <opsiquyptkf3t7b4@charles> <250804BE-49F0-11D9-AA9F-000D932DAF46@iam.unibe.ch>
Message-ID: <opsiqzlunvf3t7b4@charles>



Stef:

I have no problems with your move, I mean what can I do. Since I don't  
intend to use the Squeak version I guess I will have to enhance SmallWiki  
1 as I go and which I already have. I do have a problem with with folks  
not understanding the NC license. It has now officially become annoying to  
me. I am not sure why you all are experiencing 40 minutes on a merge. I  
assume that this is not on the SmallWiki code base because my code base  
here is so humongously larger than SmallWiki and it no where takes me as  
long. Are you all doing incremental merges?

If American Express decides to use a SmallWiki purely as its Intranet  
content server they still should pay. If you are small company and have  
your employees telephone numbers on a SmallWiki then don't pay unless you  
want support of course. Simple.

The small companies that don't work on VW don't because they don't  
understand the license. You get what you pay for. Don't get me wrong. I  
think Squeak is really cool. Some very interesting and innovative things  
have come out of it and still do and will. However, it is not an  
enterprise level development environment. It is really not that well  
suited for business development. Some people have, I understand. But one  
will hit a wall. The performance is not there, the tools are not there, it  
is just not a VW and I mean that again from a business dev perspective. I  
like Squeak especially stuff like Croquet.

-Charles


On Thu, 9 Dec 2004 15:39:34 +0100, st?phane ducasse <ducasse at iam.unibe.ch>  
wrote:

> Hi charles
>
> In fact this is a bit complex than that:
> 	- James said that normally if you do not ask for support you would not  
> have to pay
> 	- I have no problem to pay for VW but others have.
> 	- for example this is not clear if you should pay because you use a  
> wiki for a company
> 	if the wiki is used to get cusotmer information ....
> 	- we decided to move to Squeak because lukas was only developing in VW  
> for SmallWiki
> 	(but back porting to VW is something that we will always keep in mind).
> 	- May be VW is better for serving than squeak but we had to try :)
> 	- this is true that store is a bit painful (even if the tool of MC are  
> still for my taste a bit raw).
> 	But waiting 40 min for a merge is not possible for me.
> 	- We hope that more people will contribute to SmallWiki 2 :) because we  
> felt a bit alone.
> 	- SmallWiki 2 will be more a really cool contents management system  
> than a simple wiki
> 	so small companies may want to help and they often do not work in VW.
> 	- for traits they are not yet in squeak but in the pipeline for 3.9.  
> But as lukas said this should not
> 	be a problem
>
> I hope that this makes our move clearer but
>
> Stef
>
>
> On 9 d?c. 04, at 15:09, Charles A. Monteiro wrote:
>
>> I am running a SmallWiki for the NYC Smalltalk user's group. I can run  
>> it because I am not engaging in commerce i.e. it runs on a   
>> non-commercial license, to that extent it is very clear what one can  
>> and can not do. Not sure why you all are having such a difficulty in  
>> understanding this. If somebody wants to make money with SmallWiki and  
>> finds it offensive to share with the technology partner that creates  
>> the tools which allow one to run and enhance SmallWiki then said  
>> individual would have to use Squeak. BTW, BottomFeeder does not have  
>> "this issue" as you put it because it is a non-commercial product  
>> therefore it can use the "non-commercial" license.
>>
>> VW can run headless. VisualWave servers are deployed headlessly.
>>
>> I keep hearing about Monticello it would be nice to see a comparison in  
>> order to understand why it is more advanced than StORE.
>>
>> A full copy of the email apparently does did not get sent. Is there now  
>> a "traits" implementation in Squeak?
>>
>> Oh yes, why would one want to run a VNC server from within the Squeak  
>> image?
>>
>> thanks
>>
>> -Charles
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Wed, 8 Dec 2004 20:03:32 +0100, Lukas Renggli <renggli at iam.unibe.ch>  
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Chris, don't worry about porting issues with SmallWiki 2. Thanks for  
>>> all your work on SmallWiki 1!
>>>
>>> I will officially announce now that we are developing SmallWiki 2 is  
>>> Squeak, with Seaside as default view and GOODS as default backend.
>>>
>>> The main reason for this change are the followings:
>>>
>>> - The VisualWorks license sucks. Lots of people are unable to run  
>>> SmallWiki on their servers simply because they would need to buy a  
>>> Cincom license. I don't know why Bottom Feeder doesn't has this issue?
>>>
>>> - Squeak and its libraries are all open-source. The latest  
>>> implementations of Seaside and GOODS are always at your fingertips. As  
>>> versioning system we are using Monticello that is more advanced and  
>>> much faster than StORE. Squeak can be easily run headless (even with a  
>>> VNC server running within the image itself) on any machine.
>>>
>>> - Porting back SmallWiki 2 to VisualWorks should be very easy, as  
>>> there is an excellent port of Seaside by Michel Bany, adding also a  
>>> lot of methods that are commonly used in Squeak.
>>>
>>> - Traits could help a lot avoiding code duplication and with the  
>>> flattening property it is no problem to keep compatibility with other  
>>> Smalltalks.
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Lukas
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -- Charles A. Monteiro
>>
>



-- 
Charles A. Monteiro



From chris at chrisburkert.de  Thu Dec  9 19:53:58 2004
From: chris at chrisburkert.de (Chris Burkert)
Date: Thu, 09 Dec 2004 19:53:58 +0100
Subject: Squeak SmallWiki 1
In-Reply-To: <20041209090851.GB26227@iam.unibe.ch>
References: <41B74137.4000705@chrisburkert.de> <DAE994EE-494B-11D9-B168-000393CFE6C8@iam.unibe.ch> <41B7835B.2040802@chrisburkert.de> <20041209090851.GB26227@iam.unibe.ch>
Message-ID: <41B89F46.3090105@chrisburkert.de>



Alexandre Bergel wrote:
> I will definitely test it.

Great! I just have some time so I want to get Squeak SW 0.9.53 to a 
stable state and not leave it buggy.

> Is the storage mechanism works in the same way than in VisualWorks?

There is only ImageStorage which checks in an interval if something 
changed. If so it copies a backup of the old imagefile and then saves 
the image.

I believe there was SIXXStorage still in it, but obviously this has gone 
... ups ... did I miss something?

5 minutes later ... I removed SIXX as prerequisite.

5 minutes later ... I found a bug in storage ... one less :-)

cheers
            Chris Burkert
-- 
http://www.chrisburkert.de/



From ducasse at iam.unibe.ch  Thu Dec  9 19:32:17 2004
From: ducasse at iam.unibe.ch (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?st=E9phane_ducasse?=)
Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 19:32:17 +0100
Subject: [ANN] SmallWiki 2 and Squeak
In-Reply-To: <opsiqzlunvf3t7b4@charles>
References: <41B74137.4000705@chrisburkert.de> <DAE994EE-494B-11D9-B168-000393CFE6C8@iam.unibe.ch> <opsiquyptkf3t7b4@charles> <250804BE-49F0-11D9-AA9F-000D932DAF46@iam.unibe.ch> <opsiqzlunvf3t7b4@charles>
Message-ID: <A7402BC6-4A10-11D9-9591-000D932DAF46@iam.unibe.ch>




On 9 d?c. 04, at 16:50, Charles A. Monteiro wrote:

> Stef:
>
> I have no problems with your move, I mean what can I do. Since I don't 
> intend to use the Squeak version I guess I will have to enhance 
> SmallWiki 1 as I go and which I already have. I do have a problem with 
> with folks not understanding the NC license.

Me too. Because Cincom should do a much better work to communicate 
that. And for me this is crucial that VW exist and
get clients but I will not do their job.

> It has now officially become annoying to me. I am not sure why you all 
> are experiencing 40 minutes on a merge.

I do not know. I discussed with alan and we change the postgres server 
but we got even a slow down with the latest
postgres.

>  I assume that this is not on the SmallWiki code base because my code 
> base here is so humongously larger than SmallWiki and it no where 
> takes me as long. Are you all doing incremental merges?

On Moose which is not that bigger. I can tell you that I went eating 
waiting that the merge (really nothing may be ten methods there and 
there) was done.

> If American Express decides to use a SmallWiki purely as its Intranet 
> content server they still should pay. If you are small company and 
> have your employees telephone numbers on a SmallWiki then don't pay 
> unless you want support of course. Simple.

I know.

> The small companies that don't work on VW don't because they don't 
> understand the license.

Exact but what can I do. Cincom should communicate better.

> You get what you pay for. Don't get me wrong. I think Squeak is really 
> cool. Some very interesting and innovative things have come out of it 
> and still do and will. However, it is not an enterprise level 
> development environment. It is really not that well suited for 
> business development. Some people have, I understand. But one will hit 
> a wall. The performance is not there, the tools are not there, it is 
> just not a VW and I mean that again from a business dev perspective. I 
> like Squeak especially stuff like Croquet.

I know but as I said SmallWiki should first build a strong community 
and VWers were not there.
So let us cross our fingers and see. SW II will be really cool (and is 
already with seaside components) but
this is open source so people will be able to do what they want with 
it, even money if they can.

So I think that we will learn from the experience and the second 
iteration will be really better (command, better url, seaside, 
metadescription, backend based on a db....)

Stef



From ducasse at iam.unibe.ch  Thu Dec  9 19:25:49 2004
From: ducasse at iam.unibe.ch (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?st=E9phane_ducasse?=)
Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 19:25:49 +0100
Subject: [ANN] SmallWiki 2 and Squeak
In-Reply-To: <opsiqyvtllf3t7b4@charles>
References: <41B74137.4000705@chrisburkert.de> <DAE994EE-494B-11D9-B168-000393CFE6C8@iam.unibe.ch> <opsiquyptkf3t7b4@charles> <F6BCCC92-49EC-11D9-B6BB-000D93AE556A@iam.unibe.ch> <opsiqyvtllf3t7b4@charles>
Message-ID: <C0154818-4A0F-11D9-9591-000D932DAF46@iam.unibe.ch>




On 9 d?c. 04, at 16:34, Charles A. Monteiro wrote:

> Of course, that is what I said, if you want to make money with 
> SmallWiki

No you get us wrong.

> and don't want to share in the profits then you must use the Squeak 
> version. For myself I find it perfectly natural to share my profits 
> with a company who I use its products in some way. I don't like to 
> abuse or take advantage of others.

We are the same.
It happens that I know really small companies that have really to pay 
attention and this is their choice not mine. :)

> For most situations especially if you are a small company it amounts 
> to a smaller percentage than the sales tax I have to pay to the state 
> of NY i.e. worst case it probably amounts to about 6% of whatever item 
> I may for example sell on my wiki. If you don't want to eat the 6% 
> then pass it on to your customers, if they turn away from you for 6% 
> then they just did not like your product enough, unless you were 
> selling multi-million dollar jet planes in which case maybe 6% starts 
> to become a drag. BTW, if you are not making money then you are not in 
> a "commercial" setting, you are doing R&D.

But the message of cincom is not that clear and this is not really my 
problem.
Because if a small company is making money but just enough I'm not sure 
that 6% to pay on the net income
can work. If the 6% would be on the benefit this would be different.

> Now if one is so presumptuous to announce to the world that your R&D 
> is so good that it will for sure become a commercial product then one 
> should pay for one's arrogance and possibly stupidity.

We are not in this setup.

But imagine we are developing reengineering tools: the tools are freely 
available but now
is a company authorised to use it without paying a fee or having a 
commercial version of VW to run it
when it uses our free tools on their bug software. I do not really 
know. Because may be what they are doing
with it is gaining advantage of our tools. I think that from cincom 
point of view they do not care since we
are not selling the tools. But this is what marcus was implying.

> Of course , if one now gets 1 million dollars in venture capital , 
> forms a LLC etc then that sounds to me like a commercial setting. As 
> far as the developer's license that is subtracted from your overall 
> fees to Cincom. You do not need to talk to a Cincom sales rep until 
> you are ready to make money. If you are a guy in a garage coding but 
> you are not making money then you are not in a "commercial" setting. 
> You can hope to eventually be, you can pretend with your friends that 
> you are, but you are not. So don't tell Cincom that you are. 
> Everything is allright. Code. When you are ready to make money, pay 
> the people that help you make money their due. It is just the right 
> thing to do.

For me I really do not care because my goal is not to make money but we 
do not want that SmallWiki gets less
participation because it is on VW. So we gave a try in VW and now we 
are giving a try on Squeak and we will see
what are the best communities for SmallWiki but we will pay attention 
that people can port it from one to the other.
as we did for SmallWiki one.

Stef

>
> -Charles
>
> On Thu, 9 Dec 2004 15:16:48 +0100, Marcus Denker <denker at iam.unibe.ch> 
> wrote:
>
>>
>> Am 09.12.2004 um 15:09 schrieb Charles A. Monteiro:
>>
>>> I am running a SmallWiki for the NYC Smalltalk user's group. I can 
>>> run it because I am not engaging in commerce i.e. it runs on a  
>>> non-commercial license, to that extent it is very clear what one can 
>>> and can not do. Not sure why you all are having such a difficulty in 
>>> understanding this. If somebody wants to make money with SmallWiki 
>>> and finds it offensive to share with the technology partner that 
>>> creates the tools which allow one to run and enhance SmallWiki then 
>>> said individual would have to use Squeak. BTW, BottomFeeder does not 
>>> have "this issue" as you put it because it is a non-commercial 
>>> product therefore it can use the "non-commercial" license.
>>>
>> SmallWiki is a non-commercial product, too. Yet everybody *using* it 
>> in a commercial setting has to have a *developers* license.
>> We asked. This is official Cincom policy. The same is true for other 
>> projects, e.g. Moose and CodeCrawler.
>>
>>        Marcus
>
>
>
> -- 
> Charles A. Monteiro
>



From charles at datasof.com  Thu Dec  9 20:27:47 2004
From: charles at datasof.com (Charles A. Monteiro)
Date: Thu, 09 Dec 2004 14:27:47 -0500
Subject: [ANN] SmallWiki 2 and Squeak
In-Reply-To: <C0154818-4A0F-11D9-9591-000D932DAF46@iam.unibe.ch>
References: <41B74137.4000705@chrisburkert.de> <DAE994EE-494B-11D9-B168-000393CFE6C8@iam.unibe.ch> <opsiquyptkf3t7b4@charles> <F6BCCC92-49EC-11D9-B6BB-000D93AE556A@iam.unibe.ch> <opsiqyvtllf3t7b4@charles> <C0154818-4A0F-11D9-9591-000D932DAF46@iam.unibe.ch>
Message-ID: <opsiq9olynf3t7b4@charles>



One small item, I believe we would be talking about 6% of sales revenue  
i.e. my understanding is that the license I was describing (VAR I believe)  
is based on sales not profit.

-Charles


On Thu, 9 Dec 2004 19:25:49 +0100, st?phane ducasse <ducasse at iam.unibe.ch>  
wrote:

>
> On 9 d?c. 04, at 16:34, Charles A. Monteiro wrote:
>
>> Of course, that is what I said, if you want to make money with SmallWiki
>
> No you get us wrong.
>
>> and don't want to share in the profits then you must use the Squeak  
>> version. For myself I find it perfectly natural to share my profits  
>> with a company who I use its products in some way. I don't like to  
>> abuse or take advantage of others.
>
> We are the same.
> It happens that I know really small companies that have really to pay  
> attention and this is their choice not mine. :)
>
>> For most situations especially if you are a small company it amounts to  
>> a smaller percentage than the sales tax I have to pay to the state of  
>> NY i.e. worst case it probably amounts to about 6% of whatever item I  
>> may for example sell on my wiki. If you don't want to eat the 6% then  
>> pass it on to your customers, if they turn away from you for 6% then  
>> they just did not like your product enough, unless you were selling  
>> multi-million dollar jet planes in which case maybe 6% starts to become  
>> a drag. BTW, if you are not making money then you are not in a  
>> "commercial" setting, you are doing R&D.
>
> But the message of cincom is not that clear and this is not really my  
> problem.
> Because if a small company is making money but just enough I'm not sure  
> that 6% to pay on the net income
> can work. If the 6% would be on the benefit this would be different.
>
>> Now if one is so presumptuous to announce to the world that your R&D is  
>> so good that it will for sure become a commercial product then one  
>> should pay for one's arrogance and possibly stupidity.
>
> We are not in this setup.
>
> But imagine we are developing reengineering tools: the tools are freely  
> available but now
> is a company authorised to use it without paying a fee or having a  
> commercial version of VW to run it
> when it uses our free tools on their bug software. I do not really know.  
> Because may be what they are doing
> with it is gaining advantage of our tools. I think that from cincom  
> point of view they do not care since we
> are not selling the tools. But this is what marcus was implying.
>
>> Of course , if one now gets 1 million dollars in venture capital ,  
>> forms a LLC etc then that sounds to me like a commercial setting. As  
>> far as the developer's license that is subtracted from your overall  
>> fees to Cincom. You do not need to talk to a Cincom sales rep until you  
>> are ready to make money. If you are a guy in a garage coding but you  
>> are not making money then you are not in a "commercial" setting. You  
>> can hope to eventually be, you can pretend with your friends that you  
>> are, but you are not. So don't tell Cincom that you are. Everything is  
>> allright. Code. When you are ready to make money, pay the people that  
>> help you make money their due. It is just the right thing to do.
>
> For me I really do not care because my goal is not to make money but we  
> do not want that SmallWiki gets less
> participation because it is on VW. So we gave a try in VW and now we are  
> giving a try on Squeak and we will see
> what are the best communities for SmallWiki but we will pay attention  
> that people can port it from one to the other.
> as we did for SmallWiki one.
>
> Stef
>
>>
>> -Charles
>>
>> On Thu, 9 Dec 2004 15:16:48 +0100, Marcus Denker <denker at iam.unibe.ch>  
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Am 09.12.2004 um 15:09 schrieb Charles A. Monteiro:
>>>
>>>> I am running a SmallWiki for the NYC Smalltalk user's group. I can  
>>>> run it because I am not engaging in commerce i.e. it runs on a   
>>>> non-commercial license, to that extent it is very clear what one can  
>>>> and can not do. Not sure why you all are having such a difficulty in  
>>>> understanding this. If somebody wants to make money with SmallWiki  
>>>> and finds it offensive to share with the technology partner that  
>>>> creates the tools which allow one to run and enhance SmallWiki then  
>>>> said individual would have to use Squeak. BTW, BottomFeeder does not  
>>>> have "this issue" as you put it because it is a non-commercial  
>>>> product therefore it can use the "non-commercial" license.
>>>>
>>> SmallWiki is a non-commercial product, too. Yet everybody *using* it  
>>> in a commercial setting has to have a *developers* license.
>>> We asked. This is official Cincom policy. The same is true for other  
>>> projects, e.g. Moose and CodeCrawler.
>>>
>>>        Marcus
>>
>>
>>
>> -- Charles A. Monteiro
>>
>



-- 
Charles A. Monteiro



From Serge.Stinckwich at info.unicaen.fr  Thu Dec  9 21:35:03 2004
From: Serge.Stinckwich at info.unicaen.fr (Serge Stinckwich)
Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 21:35:03 +0100
Subject: [ANN] SmallWiki 2 and Squeak
In-Reply-To: <opsiquyptkf3t7b4@charles>
References: <41B74137.4000705@chrisburkert.de> <DAE994EE-494B-11D9-B168-000393CFE6C8@iam.unibe.ch> <opsiquyptkf3t7b4@charles>
Message-ID: <CE311B50-4A21-11D9-8D3F-000A95E005E4@info.unicaen.fr>




Le 9 d?c. 04, ? 15:09, Charles A. Monteiro a ?crit :

> I am running a SmallWiki for the NYC Smalltalk user's group. I can run 
> it because I am not engaging in commerce i.e. it runs on a  
> non-commercial license, to that extent it is very clear what one can 
> and can not do. Not sure why you all are having such a difficulty in 
> understanding this. If somebody wants to make money with SmallWiki and 
> finds it offensive to share with the technology partner that creates 
> the tools which allow one to run and enhance SmallWiki then said 
> individual would have to use Squeak. BTW, BottomFeeder does not have 
> "this issue" as you put it because it is a non-commercial product 
> therefore it can use the "non-commercial" license.
>
> VW can run headless. VisualWave servers are deployed headlessly.
>
> I keep hearing about Monticello it would be nice to see a comparison 
> in order to understand why it is more advanced than StORE.
>
> A full copy of the email apparently does did not get sent. Is there 
> now a "traits" implementation in Squeak?
>
> Oh yes, why would one want to run a VNC server from within the Squeak 
> image?

There is a VNC server and also a VNC client into Croquet.

--                                                         oooo
Dr. Serge Stinckwich                                     OOOOOOOO
Universit? de Caen>CNRS UMR 6072>GREYC>MAD               OOESUGOO
http://purl.org/net/SergeStinckwich                       oooooo
Smalltalkers do: [:it | All with: Class, (And love: it)]   \  /
                                                             ##



From ducasse at iam.unibe.ch  Fri Dec 10 08:49:03 2004
From: ducasse at iam.unibe.ch (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?st=E9phane_ducasse?=)
Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 08:49:03 +0100
Subject: Web Site Trashed (Again)
In-Reply-To: <pv4ir09o3ra8eb3ocitsiceu3j5892b8iv@4ax.com>
References: <200412100120.iBA1KAXu054745@atlas.otago.ac.nz> <739052804120918254fc52f00@mail.gmail.com> <pv4ir09o3ra8eb3ocitsiceu3j5892b8iv@4ax.com>
Message-ID: <F5F60954-4A7F-11D9-BC6A-000D932DAF46@iam.unibe.ch>



john
we would be interested by the code for SmallWiki.

Thanks

On 10 d?c. 04, at 04:13, Jon Hylands wrote:

> On Thu, 9 Dec 2004 21:25:27 -0500, John Pierce
> <john.raymond.pierce at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Yeah -- the @ sign was not the best choice -- the technique was all I
>> was presenting.  Most captcha's use a gif image instead of ASCII art,
>> I just though ASCII art could be used as a cheap alternative.  By the
>> way, the captcha I put above is "OHIO".  I guess what I presented
>> above was rather a captcho (completely automated public Turing test to
>> keep computers and humans *out*).
>
> I guess maybe you guys missed my post -- I've implemented this, for the
> most part.
>
> http://www.huv.com/distort.gif
>
> Can anyone here integrate this into the Swiki software?
>
> Later,
> Jon
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------
>    Jon Hylands      Jon at huv.com      http://www.huv.com/jon
>
>   Project: Micro Seeker (Micro Autonomous Underwater Vehicle)
>            http://www.huv.com
>
>



From ducasse at iam.unibe.ch  Fri Dec 10 13:56:33 2004
From: ducasse at iam.unibe.ch (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?st=E9phane_ducasse?=)
Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 13:56:33 +0100
Subject: Fwd: Web Site Trashed (Again)
Message-ID: <EAFF55F4-4AAA-11D9-92A4-000D932DAF46@iam.unibe.ch>



Begin forwarded message:

> From: Jon Hylands <jon at huv.com>
> Date: 10 d?cembre 2004 12:38:23 GMT+01:00
> To: The general-purpose Squeak developers list 
> <squeak-dev at lists.squeakfoundation.org>
> Subject: Re: Web Site Trashed (Again)
> Reply-To: The general-purpose Squeak developers list 
> <squeak-dev at lists.squeakfoundation.org>
>
> On Fri, 10 Dec 2004 08:49:03 +0100, st?phane ducasse 
> <ducasse at iam.unibe.ch>
> wrote:
>
>> we would be interested by the code for SmallWiki.
>
> Try this, its pretty simple...
>
> Later,
> Jon
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------
>    Jon Hylands      Jon at huv.com      http://www.huv.com/jon
>
>   Project: Micro Seeker (Micro Autonomous Underwater Vehicle)
>            http://www.huv.com
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From bergel at iam.unibe.ch  Sat Dec 11 12:27:46 2004
From: bergel at iam.unibe.ch (Alexandre Bergel)
Date: Sat, 11 Dec 2004 12:27:46 +0100
Subject: Squeak SmallWiki 1
In-Reply-To: <41B89F46.3090105@chrisburkert.de>
References: <41B74137.4000705@chrisburkert.de> <DAE994EE-494B-11D9-B168-000393CFE6C8@iam.unibe.ch> <41B7835B.2040802@chrisburkert.de> <20041209090851.GB26227@iam.unibe.ch> <41B89F46.3090105@chrisburkert.de>
Message-ID: <20041211112746.GF11732@iam.unibe.ch>



Hi!

Some comments related to my try to load Smallwiki with Squeak 3.7 or 3.9.
First, the installer script you provided does not work for me. I had to install all the packages manually.

When I evaluate 'SWServer startOn: 9090' I got immediately a rollback: MessageNotUnderstood: OrderedCollection>>removeAtIndex: not found.
Fine, I just replace this call by removeAt: 

Here a more serious issue. SWServer>>start is abstract (contains self subclassResponsability). And it is invoked by StartOn:host:ip:.

I did not check how is it in VW... I do not have so much time.

Cheers,
Alexandre

On Thu, Dec 09, 2004 at 07:53:58PM +0100, Chris Burkert wrote:
> Alexandre Bergel wrote:
> >I will definitely test it.
> 
> Great! I just have some time so I want to get Squeak SW 0.9.53 to a 
> stable state and not leave it buggy.
> 
> >Is the storage mechanism works in the same way than in VisualWorks?
> 
> There is only ImageStorage which checks in an interval if something 
> changed. If so it copies a backup of the old imagefile and then saves 
> the image.
> 
> I believe there was SIXXStorage still in it, but obviously this has gone 
> ... ups ... did I miss something?
> 
> 5 minutes later ... I removed SIXX as prerequisite.
> 
> 5 minutes later ... I found a bug in storage ... one less :-)
> 
> cheers
>            Chris Burkert
> -- 
> http://www.chrisburkert.de/

-- 
_,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
Alexandre Bergel  http://www.iam.unibe.ch/~bergel
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.



From chris at chrisburkert.de  Sun Dec 12 23:23:42 2004
From: chris at chrisburkert.de (Chris Burkert)
Date: Sun, 12 Dec 2004 23:23:42 +0100
Subject: Squeak SmallWiki 1
In-Reply-To: <20041211112746.GF11732@iam.unibe.ch>
References: <41B74137.4000705@chrisburkert.de> <DAE994EE-494B-11D9-B168-000393CFE6C8@iam.unibe.ch> <41B7835B.2040802@chrisburkert.de> <20041209090851.GB26227@iam.unibe.ch> <41B89F46.3090105@chrisburkert.de> <20041211112746.GF11732@iam.unibe.ch>
Message-ID: <41BCC4EE.9090506@chrisburkert.de>



Hi Alexandre,

thanks for your try on the port.

> Some comments related to my try to load Smallwiki with Squeak 3.7
 > or 3.9. First, the installer script you provided does not work for
 > me. I had to install all the packages manually.

Yes, this is because the port is currently only for Squeak 3.6.

> When I evaluate 'SWServer startOn: 9090' I got immediately a
 > rollback: MessageNotUnderstood: OrderedCollection>>removeAtIndex:
 > not found. Fine, I just replace this call by removeAt:
> 
> Here a more serious issue. SWServer>>start is abstract (contains
 > self subclassResponsability). And it is invoked by StartOn:host:ip:.

Will take a closer look on this in the next days.

Regards
            Chris Burkert
-- 
http://www.chrisburkert.de/



From kris.gybels at vub.ac.be  Mon Dec 13 17:34:31 2004
From: kris.gybels at vub.ac.be (Kris Gybels)
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2004 17:34:31 +0100
Subject: Short names for Pages
Message-ID: <DD828867-4D24-11D9-A409-0003930ECB5C@vub.ac.be>



I was wondering about the following: wouldn't it be nicer to base the 
url for a page on a 'short name' instead of the page's title?

I don't like this URL for example:

http://prog2.vub.ac.be:9090/declarativemetaprogramming/

When telling people to go take a look at the DMP site I'd prefer to use 
the URL like http://prog2.vub.ac.be:9090/DMP/, but I don't want to 
change the page's title to this abbreviation either. So it would be 
nice if the editor for pages allows you to not only set a 'title' for a 
page but a 'short name' for it as well (by default: none). The page's 
url should be derived from this short name.

I could probably hack this into Smallwiki myself easily, but it seems 
like a generally useful feature and I'm wondering about a small issue 
as well: should the *-syntax for making a link allow you to use short 
names for pages too? What happens when the short name of one page and 
the title of another are the same?



From charles at datasof.com  Mon Dec 13 17:57:36 2004
From: charles at datasof.com (Charles A. Monteiro)
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2004 11:57:36 -0500
Subject: Short names for Pages
In-Reply-To: <DD828867-4D24-11D9-A409-0003930ECB5C@vub.ac.be>
References: <DD828867-4D24-11D9-A409-0003930ECB5C@vub.ac.be>
Message-ID: <opsiyheansf3t7b4@charles>



Most people do not have to type in urls. Most people just need to click on  
a provided url or at worst case copy and paste onto a browser address  
line. So for most people this seems like a non-issue.

my 2 cents,

Charles


On Mon, 13 Dec 2004 17:34:31 +0100, Kris Gybels <kris.gybels at vub.ac.be>  
wrote:

> I was wondering about the following: wouldn't it be nicer to base the  
> url for a page on a 'short name' instead of the page's title?
>
> I don't like this URL for example:
>
> http://prog2.vub.ac.be:9090/declarativemetaprogramming/
>
> When telling people to go take a look at the DMP site I'd prefer to use  
> the URL like http://prog2.vub.ac.be:9090/DMP/, but I don't want to  
> change the page's title to this abbreviation either. So it would be nice  
> if the editor for pages allows you to not only set a 'title' for a page  
> but a 'short name' for it as well (by default: none). The page's url  
> should be derived from this short name.
>
> I could probably hack this into Smallwiki myself easily, but it seems  
> like a generally useful feature and I'm wondering about a small issue as  
> well: should the *-syntax for making a link allow you to use short names  
> for pages too? What happens when the short name of one page and the  
> title of another are the same?



-- 
Charles A. Monteiro



From renggli at iam.unibe.ch  Mon Dec 13 21:34:53 2004
From: renggli at iam.unibe.ch (Lukas Renggli)
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2004 21:34:53 +0100
Subject: Short names for Pages
In-Reply-To: <DD828867-4D24-11D9-A409-0003930ECB5C@vub.ac.be>
References: <DD828867-4D24-11D9-A409-0003930ECB5C@vub.ac.be>
Message-ID: <71D76064-4D46-11D9-A4A7-000393CFE6C8@iam.unibe.ch>



> When telling people to go take a look at the DMP site I'd prefer to 
> use the URL like http://prog2.vub.ac.be:9090/DMP/, but I don't want to 
> change the page's title to this abbreviation either. So it would be 
> nice if the editor for pages allows you to not only set a 'title' for 
> a page but a 'short name' for it as well (by default: none). The 
> page's url should be derived from this short name.

Maybe the easiest to do would be to introduce symbolic links. That acts 
like a proxy on any other structure somewhere in the wiki-tree. So you 
could just add another child with the name 'DMP' and let it point (or 
redirect) to the long url.

If you want you can directly commit to the cincom directory. I do not 
continue with the development of SmallWiki 1, except for bugs and the 
porting tools to migrate the data to SmallWiki 2.

> I could probably hack this into Smallwiki myself easily, but it seems 
> like a generally useful feature and I'm wondering about a small issue 
> as well: should the *-syntax for making a link allow you to use short 
> names for pages too? What happens when the short name of one page and 
> the title of another are the same?

Yes, you could also just open an inspector on the root node and add the 
same node twice but with different keys into the children dictionary. I 
think this could work, but I've never tried.

Cheers,
Lukas

-- 
Lukas Renggli
http://www.lukas-renggli.ch



From kris.gybels at vub.ac.be  Tue Dec 14 11:02:08 2004
From: kris.gybels at vub.ac.be (Kris Gybels)
Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 11:02:08 +0100
Subject: Creating a 'private space' in public wiki
Message-ID: <36F6D0D2-4DB7-11D9-A409-0003930ECB5C@vub.ac.be>



Another question: how do I create a 'private space' on an otherwise 
publicly accessible wiki? I want to set up a folder that only logged in 
users can view, but not the anonymous user.

(I've added this as a question to the FAQ btw: 
http://kilana.unibe.ch/SmallWiki/FAQ#Q14)



From renggli at iam.unibe.ch  Tue Dec 14 12:08:48 2004
From: renggli at iam.unibe.ch (Lukas Renggli)
Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 12:08:48 +0100
Subject: Creating a 'private space' in public wiki
In-Reply-To: <36F6D0D2-4DB7-11D9-A409-0003930ECB5C@vub.ac.be>
References: <36F6D0D2-4DB7-11D9-A409-0003930ECB5C@vub.ac.be>
Message-ID: <873286A4-4DC0-11D9-A4A7-000393CFE6C8@iam.unibe.ch>



How do I create a page/folder that can only be viewed by a specific set 
of users (in a wiki that is otherwise publicly accessible)?

 From the SmallWiki evaluate:

	(server root at: 'Top Secret Folder')
		roles: (OrderedCollection
               " a role without any permissions "
			with: (BasicRole name: 'anonymous'))
				
 From now on all people belonging to the anonymous role have no 
permission, like the anonymous user. To access the page you have to 
belong to a different role, e.g. having the admin role.

Hope this helps,
Lukas

-- 
Lukas Renggli
http://www.lukas-renggli.ch



From squeakuser at inglang.com  Tue Dec 14 21:19:18 2004
From: squeakuser at inglang.com (Darius)
Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 12:19:18 -0800
Subject: Complete SmallWiki image available?
Message-ID: <1103055558.41bf4ac61aeb2@webmail.namezero.com>





I've tried several times to load SmallWiki into Squeak 3.6 without success,
including loading it manually.

The first problem was that the SmaCC Scanner didn't initialize the writeStream.

Does someone have a minimal working image I can downlaod? Or, must I wait for
SmallWiki 2?

Thank you for such an inspiring application!

Cheers,
Darius



From chris at chrisburkert.de  Tue Dec 14 23:01:14 2004
From: chris at chrisburkert.de (Chris Burkert)
Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 23:01:14 +0100
Subject: Complete SmallWiki image available?
In-Reply-To: <1103055558.41bf4ac61aeb2@webmail.namezero.com>
References: <1103055558.41bf4ac61aeb2@webmail.namezero.com>
Message-ID: <41BF62AA.5000406@chrisburkert.de>



> I've tried several times to load SmallWiki into Squeak 3.6 without success,
> including loading it manually.

I just tried loading it and it worked perfect.

- take a fresh 3.6 image (I use 5429-basic or 5429-full)
- open the package loader
- install the package SmallWiki
   - answer 'no' or 'OK' to the questions from KomHttpServer
   - a Workspace should open up (SWServer defaultWorkspace)

 > Does someone have a minimal working image I can downlaod? Or, must I
 > wait for SmallWiki 2?

I'm just uploading a prepared image to [1]. Should be up in 5 minutes.

Regards
            Chris Burkert

1: http://www.chrisburkert.de/download/squeak/SmallWiki/
-- 
http://www.chrisburkert.de/



From squeakuser at inglang.com  Wed Dec 15 09:55:22 2004
From: squeakuser at inglang.com (Darius)
Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2004 00:55:22 -0800
Subject: Complete SmallWiki image available?
In-Reply-To: <41BF62AA.5000406@chrisburkert.de>
References: <1103055558.41bf4ac61aeb2@webmail.namezero.com> <41BF62AA.5000406@chrisburkert.de>
Message-ID: <1103100922.41bffbfa5423a@webmail.namezero.com>



Thank you Chris!

The image works well.
(Did have one VM crash when saving/closing with the server running.)

Now I'll really enjoy wiki hosting.

I'm still looking forward to SmallWiki 2 for mroe delight in programming.

One little problem I've not found addressed. Anonomous doesn't seem to have read
authority. Any suggestions?

Cheers,
Darius



From kris.gybels at vub.ac.be  Wed Dec 15 13:54:39 2004
From: kris.gybels at vub.ac.be (Kris Gybels)
Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2004 13:54:39 +0100
Subject: Creating a 'private space' in public wiki
In-Reply-To: <873286A4-4DC0-11D9-A4A7-000393CFE6C8@iam.unibe.ch>
References: <36F6D0D2-4DB7-11D9-A409-0003930ECB5C@vub.ac.be> <873286A4-4DC0-11D9-A4A7-000393CFE6C8@iam.unibe.ch>
Message-ID: <7B2EF58C-4E98-11D9-A409-0003930ECB5C@vub.ac.be>



Thanks for the hint Lukas, I was able to create a 'private page' now. 
Unfortunately I still have a problem with it: changes to the private 
pages still wind up in the RSS feed. Does the RSS feed generation use a 
different role from 'anonymous' or does it ignore the permissions 
system altogether? How can this be fixed (apart from simply disabling 
the RSS feeds preferably)?

> How do I create a page/folder that can only be viewed by a specific 
> set of users (in a wiki that is otherwise publicly accessible)?
>
> From the SmallWiki evaluate:
>
> 	(server root at: 'Top Secret Folder')
> 		roles: (OrderedCollection
>               " a role without any permissions "
> 			with: (BasicRole name: 'anonymous'))
> 				
> From now on all people belonging to the anonymous role have no 
> permission, like the anonymous user. To access the page you have to 
> belong to a different role, e.g. having the admin role.
>
> Hope this helps,
> Lukas
>
> -- 
> Lukas Renggli
> http://www.lukas-renggli.ch
>



From renggli at iam.unibe.ch  Wed Dec 15 14:35:27 2004
From: renggli at iam.unibe.ch (Lukas Renggli)
Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2004 14:35:27 +0100
Subject: Creating a 'private space' in public wiki
In-Reply-To: <7B2EF58C-4E98-11D9-A409-0003930ECB5C@vub.ac.be>
References: <36F6D0D2-4DB7-11D9-A409-0003930ECB5C@vub.ac.be> <873286A4-4DC0-11D9-A4A7-000393CFE6C8@iam.unibe.ch> <7B2EF58C-4E98-11D9-A409-0003930ECB5C@vub.ac.be>
Message-ID: <2E37E255-4E9E-11D9-AD70-000393CFE6C8@iam.unibe.ch>



> Thanks for the hint Lukas, I was able to create a 'private page' now. 
> Unfortunately I still have a problem with it: changes to the private 
> pages still wind up in the RSS feed. Does the RSS feed generation use 
> a different role from 'anonymous' or does it ignore the permissions 
> system altogether? How can this be fixed (apart from simply disabling 
> the RSS feeds preferably)?

Yes, this is a known problem: the security for the object to be listed 
isn't checked when generating the history or the RSS feed. The given 
security model makes such checks difficult, but I think it should be 
possible to add. Have a look at the action creating the RSS feed. 
SmallWiki 2 will have a more elaborate security model, so that such 
check will be simpler.

Cheers,
Lukas

-- 
Lukas Renggli
http://www.lukas-renggli.ch



From chris at chrisburkert.de  Wed Dec 15 17:10:09 2004
From: chris at chrisburkert.de (Chris Burkert)
Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2004 17:10:09 +0100
Subject: Complete SmallWiki image available?
In-Reply-To: <1103100922.41bffbfa5423a@webmail.namezero.com>
References: <1103055558.41bf4ac61aeb2@webmail.namezero.com> <41BF62AA.5000406@chrisburkert.de> <1103100922.41bffbfa5423a@webmail.namezero.com>
Message-ID: <41C061E1.5020103@chrisburkert.de>



Darius wrote:
> Now I'll really enjoy wiki hosting.

This port is quite young so please report any bug to me please!

> One little problem I've not found addressed. Anonomous doesn't seem to have read
> authority. Any suggestions?

Anonomous has, but you can assign specific Roles to a structure. Try 
something like this:

server root
   roles: (OrderedCollection with: server defaultRoleAnonymous).

Then the user will get replaced its roles with the corresponding role 
from the structure if any.

Also I would change the anonymous role to only permissionView (removing 
add and edit) to not let everybody do stuff.

Regards
            Chris Burkert
-- 
http://www.chrisburkert.de/



From fservais at ulb.ac.be  Wed Dec 15 18:21:09 2004
From: fservais at ulb.ac.be (Frederic Servais)
Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2004 18:21:09 +0100
Subject: TEmplateBodyActions customize
In-Reply-To: <41C061E1.5020103@chrisburkert.de>
References: <1103055558.41bf4ac61aeb2@webmail.namezero.com> <41BF62AA.5000406@chrisburkert.de> <1103100922.41bffbfa5423a@webmail.namezero.com> <41C061E1.5020103@chrisburkert.de>
Message-ID: <B644ABA0-4EBD-11D9-91E4-00039344856E@ulb.ac.be>



Hi,

I am developping a Extension for SmallWiki and have a small problem.

I made a subclass of Page and would like to have the 
TemplateBodyActions (the actions links menu upper right corner) to 
display only the actions I decide for this type of page. How can I do 
this?
This is the kinbd of stuff you do with the componentEditor: you add 
from some actions to be displayed.

Any help is very welcomed,

Thanks

FreD.



From alistair at alphalink.com.au  Thu Dec 16 18:30:21 2004
From: alistair at alphalink.com.au (alistair@alphalink.com.au)
Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 04:30:21 +1100
Subject: File Server and storage
Message-ID: <20041216172546.M2071@alphalink.com.au>



Hi All,

My understanding is that work on WikiWorks has stopped and that SmallWiki is 
the future.  I've tried running SmallWiki with some success, however there 
are a few things where I hope my impression is wrong:

- Is it possible to configure the simple file server (as described at 
http://wiki.openskills.net/OpenSkills/Smalltalk+HTTP+Server) to be able to 
do directory listings if there isn't an index.html in the requested 
directory (like the WikiWorks FileServerWiki and Apache)?

- Is it possible to store page definitions (with history) outside the image 
(to prevent image bloat and allow page history to be on disk rather than in 
memory)?


Many Thanks,

Alistair.



From renggli at iam.unibe.ch  Thu Dec 16 21:45:20 2004
From: renggli at iam.unibe.ch (Lukas Renggli)
Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2004 21:45:20 +0100
Subject: File Server and storage
In-Reply-To: <20041216172546.M2071@alphalink.com.au>
References: <20041216172546.M2071@alphalink.com.au>
Message-ID: <66655C06-4FA3-11D9-9EE3-000393CFE6C8@iam.unibe.ch>



> My understanding is that work on WikiWorks has stopped and that 
> SmallWiki is the future.

Yes, objects are the future ;-)

> - Is it possible to configure the simple file server (as described at
> http://wiki.openskills.net/OpenSkills/Smalltalk+HTTP+Server) to be 
> able to
> do directory listings if there isn't an index.html in the requested
> directory (like the WikiWorks FileServerWiki and Apache)?

We are using apache rewrite rules to do things like this. However it 
would be simple to add a new structure type that maps to a directory in 
the filesystem.

> - Is it possible to store page definitions (with history) outside the 
> image
> (to prevent image bloat and allow page history to be on disk rather 
> than in
> memory)?

Ralph Johnson implemented such a storage-system for SallWiki. See in 
the mailing-list archive for discussions about this. I don't know about 
the current status and its stability.

SmallWiki 2 will be based on GOODS, an object database. This will be 
really cool, because the whole object graph is stored outside the image 
in a complete transparent manner.

Cheers,
Lukas

-- 
Lukas Renggli
http://www.lukas-renggli.ch



From inglang.com at inglang.com  Thu Dec 16 22:29:29 2004
From: inglang.com at inglang.com (inglang.com@inglang.com)
Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2004 13:29:29 -0800
Subject: Complete SmallWiki image available?
In-Reply-To: <41C061E1.5020103@chrisburkert.de>
References: <1103055558.41bf4ac61aeb2@webmail.namezero.com> <41BF62AA.5000406@chrisburkert.de> <1103100922.41bffbfa5423a@webmail.namezero.com> <41C061E1.5020103@chrisburkert.de>
Message-ID: <1103232569.41c1fe394f4d9@webmail.namezero.com>



Thanks.
That made the difference.

Cheers,
Darius



From charles at datasof.com  Fri Dec 17 17:37:12 2004
From: charles at datasof.com (Charles A. Monteiro)
Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 11:37:12 -0500
Subject: File Server and storage
In-Reply-To: <20041216172546.M2071@alphalink.com.au>
References: <20041216172546.M2071@alphalink.com.au>
Message-ID: <opsi5u4apgf3t7b4@charles>



SmallWiki 1 runs under Swazoo so there may be ways of using Swazoo for the  
less-wiki like stuff. I have some large installers that I provide links to  
on the wiki, about 4mb,  which I don't want to load as a resource into the  
wiki. Currently, I am simply using VisualWave to serve those files.

A VisualWorks image can handle "bloat" pretty well especially via  
manipulating the Object memory settings. I don't use the ImageSnapshot  
storage mechanism though, so by image bloat I really mean memory growth.  
Instead I implemented a Boss based storage which allows me to recover. I  
thought about using OmniBase, from what I hear it is pretty good for what  
it is i.e. a lightweight object database. So from my perspective using  
GOODS for SmallWiki 2 is a good move. The only issue I fear is that I  
don't know if the Squeak VM will be able to handle the load of file  
serving , oodms services etc.

I have not tested the performance of the Squeak VM in a while. I don't  
believe it matches the performance of the VisualWorks VM but perhaps it is  
adequate enough.

BTW, SmallWiki 1 (still available in VW if that matters) with some minor  
extension i.e. Boss storage mechanism, as far as a straightahead wiki  
which includes a usable permissions framework, seems to do the job fairly  
well.

-Charles


On Fri, 17 Dec 2004 04:30:21 +1100, <alistair at alphalink.com.au> wrote:

> Hi All,
>
> My understanding is that work on WikiWorks has stopped and that  
> SmallWiki is
> the future.  I've tried running SmallWiki with some success, however  
> there
> are a few things where I hope my impression is wrong:
>
> - Is it possible to configure the simple file server (as described at
> http://wiki.openskills.net/OpenSkills/Smalltalk+HTTP+Server) to be able  
> to
> do directory listings if there isn't an index.html in the requested
> directory (like the WikiWorks FileServerWiki and Apache)?
>
> - Is it possible to store page definitions (with history) outside the  
> image
> (to prevent image bloat and allow page history to be on disk rather than  
> in
> memory)?
>
>
> Many Thanks,
>
> Alistair.



-- 
Charles A. Monteiro



From squeakuser at inglang.com  Fri Dec 17 18:02:47 2004
From: squeakuser at inglang.com (Darius)
Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 09:02:47 -0800
Subject: All New Pages from Link Defaults to "Resource"
In-Reply-To: <opsi5u4apgf3t7b4@charles>
References: <20041216172546.M2071@alphalink.com.au> <opsi5u4apgf3t7b4@charles>
Message-ID: <1103302967.41c3113798d4a@webmail.namezero.com>



When I create any new *Internal Link* the page properly has links to create
Folder, Page, or Resource. However, clicking on any of the links always
defaults to creating a Resource page.

Please let me know the steps how you go about finding this bug, so I can
recreate the steps and learn my self.

Cheers,
Darius



From squeakuser at inglang.com  Fri Dec 17 19:19:10 2004
From: squeakuser at inglang.com (Darius)
Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 10:19:10 -0800
Subject: How do I run the test suite in Squeak?
In-Reply-To: <1103302967.41c3113798d4a@webmail.namezero.com>
References: <20041216172546.M2071@alphalink.com.au> <opsi5u4apgf3t7b4@charles> <1103302967.41c3113798d4a@webmail.namezero.com>
Message-ID: <1103307550.41c3231ed6d20@webmail.namezero.com>



How do I run the test suite in Squeak?
(Could you also post this on the SmallWikiSetup page of the SGC SmallWiki wiki.
http://kilana.unibe.ch/smallwiki/smallwikisetup/)

What is the proper way to load your latest updates into Squeak?
(Assuming you have any before ver 2 is released.)



From ducasse at iam.unibe.ch  Fri Dec 17 21:29:46 2004
From: ducasse at iam.unibe.ch (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?st=E9phane_ducasse?=)
Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 21:29:46 +0100
Subject: File Server and storage
In-Reply-To: <opsi5u4apgf3t7b4@charles>
References: <20041216172546.M2071@alphalink.com.au> <opsi5u4apgf3t7b4@charles>
Message-ID: <646652C4-506A-11D9-BEFB-000D932DAF46@iam.unibe.ch>



may be charles you should publish your changes on cincomstore.

Stef

On 17 d?c. 04, at 17:37, Charles A. Monteiro wrote:

> SmallWiki 1 runs under Swazoo so there may be ways of using Swazoo for 
> the less-wiki like stuff. I have some large installers that I provide 
> links to on the wiki, about 4mb,  which I don't want to load as a 
> resource into the wiki. Currently, I am simply using VisualWave to 
> serve those files.
>
> A VisualWorks image can handle "bloat" pretty well especially via 
> manipulating the Object memory settings. I don't use the ImageSnapshot 
> storage mechanism though, so by image bloat I really mean memory 
> growth. Instead I implemented a Boss based storage which allows me to 
> recover. I thought about using OmniBase, from what I hear it is pretty 
> good for what it is i.e. a lightweight object database. So from my 
> perspective using GOODS for SmallWiki 2 is a good move. The only issue 
> I fear is that I don't know if the Squeak VM will be able to handle 
> the load of file serving , oodms services etc.
>
> I have not tested the performance of the Squeak VM in a while. I don't 
> believe it matches the performance of the VisualWorks VM but perhaps 
> it is adequate enough.
>
> BTW, SmallWiki 1 (still available in VW if that matters) with some 
> minor extension i.e. Boss storage mechanism, as far as a straightahead 
> wiki which includes a usable permissions framework, seems to do the 
> job fairly well.
>
> -Charles
>
>
> On Fri, 17 Dec 2004 04:30:21 +1100, <alistair at alphalink.com.au> wrote:
>
>> Hi All,
>>
>> My understanding is that work on WikiWorks has stopped and that 
>> SmallWiki is
>> the future.  I've tried running SmallWiki with some success, however 
>> there
>> are a few things where I hope my impression is wrong:
>>
>> - Is it possible to configure the simple file server (as described at
>> http://wiki.openskills.net/OpenSkills/Smalltalk+HTTP+Server) to be 
>> able to
>> do directory listings if there isn't an index.html in the requested
>> directory (like the WikiWorks FileServerWiki and Apache)?
>>
>> - Is it possible to store page definitions (with history) outside the 
>> image
>> (to prevent image bloat and allow page history to be on disk rather 
>> than in
>> memory)?
>>
>>
>> Many Thanks,
>>
>> Alistair.
>
>
>
> -- 
> Charles A. Monteiro
>



From squeak at skalarsoft.com  Mon Dec 20 18:03:00 2004
From: squeak at skalarsoft.com (Andreas Gerdes)
Date: Mon, 20 Dec 2004 18:03:00 +0100
Subject: Squeak SmallWiki1 Hierarchical Menu & ascii > 127
In-Reply-To: <20041209090851.GB26227@iam.unibe.ch>
References: <41B74137.4000705@chrisburkert.de> <DAE994EE-494B-11D9-B168-000393CFE6C8@iam.unibe.ch> <41B7835B.2040802@chrisburkert.de> <20041209090851.GB26227@iam.unibe.ch>
Message-ID: <41C705C4.8010807@skalarsoft.com>

Hi all,

I have attached two changesets for SmallWiki1 in Squeak:

*HierarchyMenu* outputs a menu like the one on our site, for example
http://www.squeak-ev.de/Dokumentation/Glossar/Malkasten/

*Umlaut* just adds one line to SWHtmlWriteStream.text:

text: aString
	| table escape |

	table := self escapeTable.
	aString do: [ :character |
">>> following line added"
		character _ character isoToSqueak.
		escape := table at: character ifAbsent: [ nil ].
		escape isNil
			ifTrue: [ self nextPut: character]
			ifFalse: [ self nextPutAll: escape] ]

If I am not completely wrong, this line is essential to anyone, who 
wants to properly handle characters > 127, unless he runs his image on a 
MacOs-Server...

Regards
Andreas
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From charles at datasof.com  Tue Dec 21 14:40:17 2004
From: charles at datasof.com (Charles A. Monteiro)
Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2004 08:40:17 -0500
Subject: File Server and storage
In-Reply-To: <646652C4-506A-11D9-BEFB-000D932DAF46@iam.unibe.ch>
References: <20041216172546.M2071@alphalink.com.au> <opsi5u4apgf3t7b4@charles> <646652C4-506A-11D9-BEFB-000D932DAF46@iam.unibe.ch>
Message-ID: <opsjc1lfh3f3t7b4@charles>



The BOSS Storage is increidibly simple. I have not thought about putting  
it up there because it seems folks were not interested i.e. it is so  
simple that you would think somebody would have implemented already were  
they interested. Nobody has really expressed direct interest in it either.  
I'll put on my task list to publish it though. The other extension is just  
a mechanism to load/unload my wiki's configuration from a file including  
users and permissions. I do have some other functionality that I will have  
to finish for the wiki to do what I need to do but the thing is that now  
that the project is moving to Squeak and SmallWiki 2 not sure of how much  
benefit it is to publish SmallWiki 1 VW stuff. It is useful for me to work  
on VW SmallWiki 1 because I do need to stay on with VW and I need  
something stable which SmallWiki 2 is not yet.

-Charles

On Fri, 17 Dec 2004 21:29:46 +0100, st?phane ducasse  
<ducasse at iam.unibe.ch> wrote:

> may be charles you should publish your changes on cincomstore.
>
> Stef
>
> On 17 d?c. 04, at 17:37, Charles A. Monteiro wrote:
>
>> SmallWiki 1 runs under Swazoo so there may be ways of using Swazoo for  
>> the less-wiki like stuff. I have some large installers that I provide  
>> links to on the wiki, about 4mb,  which I don't want to load as a  
>> resource into the wiki. Currently, I am simply using VisualWave to  
>> serve those files.
>>
>> A VisualWorks image can handle "bloat" pretty well especially via  
>> manipulating the Object memory settings. I don't use the ImageSnapshot  
>> storage mechanism though, so by image bloat I really mean memory  
>> growth. Instead I implemented a Boss based storage which allows me to  
>> recover. I thought about using OmniBase, from what I hear it is pretty  
>> good for what it is i.e. a lightweight object database. So from my  
>> perspective using GOODS for SmallWiki 2 is a good move. The only issue  
>> I fear is that I don't know if the Squeak VM will be able to handle the  
>> load of file serving , oodms services etc.
>>
>> I have not tested the performance of the Squeak VM in a while. I don't  
>> believe it matches the performance of the VisualWorks VM but perhaps it  
>> is adequate enough.
>>
>> BTW, SmallWiki 1 (still available in VW if that matters) with some  
>> minor extension i.e. Boss storage mechanism, as far as a straightahead  
>> wiki which includes a usable permissions framework, seems to do the job  
>> fairly well.
>>
>> -Charles
>>
>>
>> On Fri, 17 Dec 2004 04:30:21 +1100, <alistair at alphalink.com.au> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi All,
>>>
>>> My understanding is that work on WikiWorks has stopped and that  
>>> SmallWiki is
>>> the future.  I've tried running SmallWiki with some success, however  
>>> there
>>> are a few things where I hope my impression is wrong:
>>>
>>> - Is it possible to configure the simple file server (as described at
>>> http://wiki.openskills.net/OpenSkills/Smalltalk+HTTP+Server) to be  
>>> able to
>>> do directory listings if there isn't an index.html in the requested
>>> directory (like the WikiWorks FileServerWiki and Apache)?
>>>
>>> - Is it possible to store page definitions (with history) outside the  
>>> image
>>> (to prevent image bloat and allow page history to be on disk rather  
>>> than in
>>> memory)?
>>>
>>>
>>> Many Thanks,
>>>
>>> Alistair.
>>
>>
>>
>> -- Charles A. Monteiro
>>
>



-- 
Charles A. Monteiro



From alistair at alphalink.com.au  Wed Dec 22 12:05:51 2004
From: alistair at alphalink.com.au (Alistair Grant)
Date: Wed, 22 Dec 2004 22:05:51 +1100
Subject: File Server and storage
In-Reply-To: <opsjc1lfh3f3t7b4@charles>
Message-ID: <20041222110558.4E0F425BAA9@mailhub01.unibe.ch>



Hi Lukas & Charles,

Many thanks for your replies.  I should have said in my original message
that I tried SmallWiki 1 on VisualWorks.

This is a personal web site, so there is no significant load, and I'm trying
to avoid having to deal with Apache. :-)

Using VisualWave to serve up files seems like a good idea.  I had a quick
look, but couldn't see any native ability to do this.  Charles, is this
something you wrote yourself?

It looks like moving to SmallWiki 2 is the way to go.  However the latest
version (1.18) is described as "Broken" in the Cincom Store, and Charles
indicated that stability is a problem, so it sounds like I'll stay with what
I've got for the moment and keep an eye on the list to see when SmallWiki2
settles down.

Thanks again,

Alistair.




From charles at datasof.com  Wed Dec 22 15:33:52 2004
From: charles at datasof.com (Charles A. Monteiro)
Date: Wed, 22 Dec 2004 09:33:52 -0500
Subject: File Server and storage
In-Reply-To: <20041222110558.4E0F425BAA9@mailhub01.unibe.ch>
References: <20041222110558.4E0F425BAA9@mailhub01.unibe.ch>
Message-ID: <opsjeyqqzvf3t7b4@charles>



Alistair:

Serving files is quite easy from VisualWave. Do the following:

Go Parcel Manager>>>Application Server >>> Sugesttions and load:
VisualWave
VisualWave Demos

Click Web Server Console now found on Launcher.
Click "Create Server"
Choose "Server Type" to be: WaveHttpRequestBroker
Change the "hostname" if you like, note that in the case of file serving  
it is irrelevant i.e. i.e. non-html files , pdf,etc
Change the port if you like
Click "Create" found at bottom of screen.
Click on list entry above for newly created server.
Click "Edit Resolver"
Click "Add Path"
Choose "Resolver Type" to be: VisualWave.FileResponder
Enter Path for example "files" Note: path means a token on url used to  
locate the service, has nothing to do with
a path on the file system , sorry had to be said just in case.
Click "Accept"
Select newly created responder from list on left side pane.
Click "Configure Resolver"
Change "Default Directory" if you do not like the specified location
Click "Accept changes"
Click "Back to Resolver"
Click "Start" immediately underneath server listings which will activate  
your server.

Then place content under the file system directory associated to  
FileResponder created above.

then go to a web browser preferably Opera

and enter something like:

http://mydomain.com:9999/files/myfile.pdf, voila.


Note that recently, they have re-configured Wave to exist under the  
Opentalk framework but did not have the time to update the UI's so there  
are some bugs related to that which you will not encounter if you follow  
the steps outlined above. For example if you decide you want to "edit" the  
port number you will encounter a bug associated to an AspectAdaptor  
assuming it was still adapting the same type of entity. Maybe that is  
fixed in 7.3.

Hope that helps :)

-Charles


On Wed, 22 Dec 2004 22:05:51 +1100, Alistair Grant  
<alistair at alphalink.com.au> wrote:

> Hi Lukas & Charles,
>
> Many thanks for your replies.  I should have said in my original message
> that I tried SmallWiki 1 on VisualWorks.
>
> This is a personal web site, so there is no significant load, and I'm  
> trying
> to avoid having to deal with Apache. :-)
>
> Using VisualWave to serve up files seems like a good idea.  I had a quick
> look, but couldn't see any native ability to do this.  Charles, is this
> something you wrote yourself?
>
> It looks like moving to SmallWiki 2 is the way to go.  However the latest
> version (1.18) is described as "Broken" in the Cincom Store, and Charles
> indicated that stability is a problem, so it sounds like I'll stay with  
> what
> I've got for the moment and keep an eye on the list to see when  
> SmallWiki2
> settles down.
>
> Thanks again,
>
> Alistair.
>
>



-- 
Charles A. Monteiro



From charles at datasof.com  Thu Dec 23 14:02:26 2004
From: charles at datasof.com (Charles A. Monteiro)
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2004 08:02:26 -0500
Subject: File Server and storage
In-Reply-To: <opsjeyqqzvf3t7b4@charles>
References: <20041222110558.4E0F425BAA9@mailhub01.unibe.ch> <opsjeyqqzvf3t7b4@charles>
Message-ID: <opsjgo6cgcf3t7b4@charles>



In re-reading my post, I noticed I may have said some misleading, with  
regards to changing the port number at the time of Wave server creation  
that works fine, trying to change it after the server is created will  
raise a bug associated to an AspectAdaptor performing something not  
understood i.e.#port

-Charles

On Wed, 22 Dec 2004 09:33:52 -0500, Charles A. Monteiro  
<charles at datasof.com> wrote:

> Alistair:
>
> Serving files is quite easy from VisualWave. Do the following:
>
> Go Parcel Manager>>>Application Server >>> Sugesttions and load:
> VisualWave
> VisualWave Demos
>
> Click Web Server Console now found on Launcher.
> Click "Create Server"
> Choose "Server Type" to be: WaveHttpRequestBroker
> Change the "hostname" if you like, note that in the case of file serving  
> it is irrelevant i.e. i.e. non-html files , pdf,etc
> Change the port if you like
> Click "Create" found at bottom of screen.
> Click on list entry above for newly created server.
> Click "Edit Resolver"
> Click "Add Path"
> Choose "Resolver Type" to be: VisualWave.FileResponder
> Enter Path for example "files" Note: path means a token on url used to  
> locate the service, has nothing to do with
> a path on the file system , sorry had to be said just in case.
> Click "Accept"
> Select newly created responder from list on left side pane.
> Click "Configure Resolver"
> Change "Default Directory" if you do not like the specified location
> Click "Accept changes"
> Click "Back to Resolver"
> Click "Start" immediately underneath server listings which will activate  
> your server.
>
> Then place content under the file system directory associated to  
> FileResponder created above.
>
> then go to a web browser preferably Opera
>
> and enter something like:
>
> http://mydomain.com:9999/files/myfile.pdf, voila.
>
>
> Note that recently, they have re-configured Wave to exist under the  
> Opentalk framework but did not have the time to update the UI's so there  
> are some bugs related to that which you will not encounter if you follow  
> the steps outlined above. For example if you decide you want to "edit"  
> the port number you will encounter a bug associated to an AspectAdaptor  
> assuming it was still adapting the same type of entity. Maybe that is  
> fixed in 7.3.
>
> Hope that helps :)
>
> -Charles
>
>
> On Wed, 22 Dec 2004 22:05:51 +1100, Alistair Grant  
> <alistair at alphalink.com.au> wrote:
>
>> Hi Lukas & Charles,
>>
>> Many thanks for your replies.  I should have said in my original message
>> that I tried SmallWiki 1 on VisualWorks.
>>
>> This is a personal web site, so there is no significant load, and I'm  
>> trying
>> to avoid having to deal with Apache. :-)
>>
>> Using VisualWave to serve up files seems like a good idea.  I had a  
>> quick
>> look, but couldn't see any native ability to do this.  Charles, is this
>> something you wrote yourself?
>>
>> It looks like moving to SmallWiki 2 is the way to go.  However the  
>> latest
>> version (1.18) is described as "Broken" in the Cincom Store, and Charles
>> indicated that stability is a problem, so it sounds like I'll stay with  
>> what
>> I've got for the moment and keep an eye on the list to see when  
>> SmallWiki2
>> settles down.
>>
>> Thanks again,
>>
>> Alistair.
>>
>>
>
>
>



-- 
Charles A. Monteiro



From renggli at iam.unibe.ch  Fri Dec 31 09:35:01 2004
From: renggli at iam.unibe.ch (Lukas Renggli)
Date: Fri, 31 Dec 2004 09:35:01 +0100
Subject: Problems with callbacks in SmallWiki with Squeak 3.7
In-Reply-To: <opsjuxdt1sh9xbke@sandtonsvr>
References: <opsjuxdt1sh9xbke@sandtonsvr>
Message-ID: <DC9F576A-5B06-11D9-8299-000393CFE6C8@iam.unibe.ch>



Hi Brent,

the maintainer of the Squeak port of SmallWiki 1 is Chris Burkert, 
please ask him for problems related to the Squeak port.

>    [ :context | context createChildFromClass: each
>                    titled: aLinkInternal reference
>                       creator: action structure ]
>
> [...]
>
> I believe the problem is that the default Compiler in Squeak 3.7 does 
> not capture the full closure.

Looks like I know this particular problem in Squeak ;-)

Try sending #fixTemps to the block you mentioned above. If this solves 
your problem you might want to add #fixTemp to the references of aBlock 
in the following two methods:
	
	HtmlWriteStream>>registerAnchorCallback:to:
	HtmlWriteStream>>registerFormCallback:

Cheers,
Lukas

On Dec 31, 2004, at 06:26, Brent Pinkney wrote:

> Hi Lukas,
>
> I am trying to install a wiki at work and am hoping to use 
> Smallwiki/Squeak to try introduce Smalltalk via the back door.
>
> I have had some problems with SmallWiki on Squeak 3.7 final.
>
> Significantly I when I edit a page to contain a link to aonother Swiki 
> page (ie. *A New Page*)
>
> I get back HTML with links to create the new page:
>
> A New Page (Folder, Page, Resource)
>
> Each link in the parenthesis has the following URL:
>
> Folder: http://localhost:8080/anewpage/??action=SWPageView&callback=6
> Page:   http://localhost:8080/anewpage/??action=SWPageView&callback=7
> Page:   http://localhost:8080/anewpage/??action=SWPageView&callback=8
>
> Each callback is a block of code created by 
> SWVisitorRendererHtml>>emitCreateTargetFor:
>
> The call back is the block:
>
>    [ :context | context createChildFromClass: each
>                    titled: aLinkInternal reference
>                       creator: action structure ]
>
> The parameter each the formal argument over the array #(SWFolder 
> SWPAge SWResource) created by the call to #creatableStructures.
>
> When a user clicks on one of the links, Smallwiki find the callback 
> and executes the block. ie. It executes:
>
>     SWAction>>createChildFromClass: aClass titled: aString creator: 
> aStructure
>
> The formal agrument aClass should be the each variable when the block 
> was captured, ie. ONE of SWFolder, SWPage or SWResource.
>
> The problem is it is always SWResource.
>
> The symptom of this problem is that only a resource can be created.
>
> I believe the problem is that the default Compiler in Squeak 3.7 does 
> not capture the full closure.
>
> Please can someone assist me.
>
> I am having a few other problems with Smallwiki - can you advise if 
> this release is begin used.
>
> Many thanks
>
> Brent
>
>
-- 
Lukas Renggli
http://www.lukas-renggli.ch